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So i got this email today...


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So I got this email today...

 

Whatever Kerry is, he ain't worse than the warmonger, homophobic, religious zealot who wants to take away a woman's right to choose, make it CONSTITUTIONALLY illegal for same-sex marriages to take place, ban stem-cell research and continue giving the top 1% of American's tax breaks while the rest of us empty our pockets.

 

My God, is this person serious???  First of all, it is a lot easier to throw the sound bites out there like she did, then to actually make an argument. But, I would love it if the left in this country would stop the extreme name-calling and actually have an intelligent conversation.  I believe that there are two sides to a lot of the problems we face in the world today, but calling GW a religious zealot doesn't solve the problem... nor does calling him a homophobe, a warmonger, etc.  What this tells you about those people who like to throw these things out there, is that they either have no idea that other ideas exist (i.e., they're stupid), or they have no respect for the people who hold those ideas (i.e., they think we're stupid).  I like to think that there is a middle ground, but there is no reaching it when one side holds signs on Wilshire Blvd calling the president a fascist despot.

 

Of course, I have a rebuttal to her email... a bit long, but I don't think sound bites do much good...

 

Warmonger???  Maybe it's just me, but the war in Iraq was supported by the senate and was actually part of a stated regime change policy (Iraq Liberation Act) dating back to the Clinton administration... for good reason!  Oh ya... and when the head of state of the Russia, the nation with the closest ties to Iraq, says that Hussein is planning attacks on the US, both domestically and abroad, our president should invite Saddam over to white house for dinner and talk things out, right?!  Maybe we could have a wine and cheese party with the Frenchies and see what they have to say.  God forbid we actually support our president for trying to protect us and, at the bare minimum, liberating 35 million people!

 

Why is a Christian a religious zealot?  Because someone believes in God and reads the Bible he is automatically a mad man!  I guess that's why a cross cannot be on the seal of Los Angeles County.  Oh, wait... BURN THE DECLARATION OF INDEPENDENCE AND THE NATION'S MONEY!  Why, they must have been created by religious zealots, after all, they mention "God."  How crazy are those people who believe that we were created by some higher power... jee wiz, what crazies!  Gosh, and to go around saying that you pray and go to Church... man, who let those people out of the looney bin.  But, of course, John Kerry saying that he believes in God and showing up at black churches around the country is ok... as is the "reverend" Jesse Jackson entering the political arena, and "reverend" Al Sharpton running for president.

 

A ban on stem-cell research???  What about just not using government funds to pay for it... or would you like to both complain about record deficits AND use government money to pay for research that has not proven its validity yet, while other types of research have actually shown results??? Do some research before you make claims about stem cell research.  As an aside, my wife works in a lab at UCLA and does research on Alzheimer's Disease... doctor's in the lab have made lots of discoveries that would not have been made if stem cell research were the main source of funding.  Mice that have been injected thus far with stem cells to try to "heal" them have come down with cancer... all without any good results.  So, take the ethics of stem cell out of it and make an argument for it... I'd be interested in that.  AND, you'd better believe that those same "evil" corporations (the drug companies) are spending money on stem cell research.  Of course, they don't see it as promising as you do, but hey, what the hell do they know?!

 

Homophobic???  This is the guy who is also for domestic partnerships, and holds the same opinion on gay marriage as John Kerry... and over half of the population of the US... or have you forgotten that you do not have a thought monopoly on this topic???

 

Tax cuts for the rich... aren't they people, too?  I forgot that all people who make over $200k per year are evil and deserve to pay over 50% of their income to the government (because it is so efficient and knows what to do with our money better than we do).  I also forgot that small business owners like my parents who have a hard time making ends meet at times actually make over $200K per year... wait a second... that's my dad's small business, not HIS money.  His operating expenses don't actually go to him, but they sure count in his income... and Uncle Sam doesn't mind taking it!  But of course, what good would it do to give him a tax break... I mean he could just use that money to hire someone and give him or her a job so they don't need to take unemployment or welfare... what good would that do?

 

A woman's right to choose... ya, Bush is completely alone in his views of abortion, right?  Oh ya, it was him alone that signed into law a ban on partial birth abortion, right?  Oh wait... Kerry is actually against abortion, too... oh, and then there is that whole thing about two houses of congress passing laws... which would mean that not just Bush was against partial birth abortion... not even just republicans.  I think that both houses of congress have democrats and republicans, which means a lot of people have the same views as the president.  Of course, since you've basically already pointed out that half of the nation is crazy or stupid, I guess that doesn't matter.

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Simliar items on the local tv channel's forum.  People who ignore what their Congressmen and Senators are doing (state and federal) blame it all on the current President (like any President has ever said "Hey, John Q. Public, I'm going to force your company to move their workforce overseas, ok?"  Idiots.  What part of Corporate profit margin don't they understand?

Maybe they should blame themselves for a change for not getting involved.

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I would love it if the left in this country would stop the extreme name-calling and actually have an intelligent conversation.

:rotfl:

 

I admit it - I agree with (almost) your entire post, but the left hardly has the monopoly on the name-calling and lack of intelligent conversation.

 

I tried to have an intelligent conversation with someone with differing views from mine but I've yet to get an answer out him. ???

 

WTF is the deal with all the France-bashing anyway?  Don't get me wrong-I don't have any great love of France, but Germany and other allies voiced their opposition to the Iraq invasion so why so much vitriolic ranting about the French?  

 

I'd be more worried about the Austrian Governator running the biggest (I think) economy in the US.  A FOREIGNER :ooh2:  

:joker:

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WTF is the deal with all the France-bashing anyway?  Don't get me wrong-I don't have any great love of France, but Germany and other allies voiced their opposition to the Iraq invasion so why so much vitriolic ranting about the French?  

 

I'd be more worried about the Austrian Governator running the biggest (I think) economy in the US.  A FOREIGNER :ooh2:  

:joker:

A) among other things (selling night vision to our enemies and such), they have a short memory.

 

B) The Governator is at least a LEGALLY NATURALIZED U.S. CITIZEN.  I consider him a great American.

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I like Arnold because he rides - And is shrewd businessman.

 

If he doesn't know it/how - He simply hires the best person.

 

I hope he can turn the CA economy around before his terms are up.

 

And besides - Someone finally fucked a Kennedy...

 

Thanks, Danny

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I would love it if the left in this country would stop the extreme name-calling and actually have an intelligent conversation.

:rotfl:

 

I admit it - I agree with (almost) your entire post, but the left hardly has the monopoly on the name-calling and lack of intelligent conversation.

 

I tried to have an intelligent conversation with someone with differing views from mine but I've yet to get an answer out him. ???

 

WTF is the deal with all the France-bashing anyway?  Don't get me wrong-I don't have any great love of France, but Germany and other allies voiced their opposition to the Iraq invasion so why so much vitriolic ranting about the French?  

 

I'd be more worried about the Austrian Governator running the biggest (I think) economy in the US.  A FOREIGNER :ooh2:  

:joker:

:rotfl:  :rotfl:  :rotfl:

 

I have been way busy, really. I have been up working for 50 hours straight ... that is what my other post was about. PM me your number, I will try to call you while I am driving. Ask Blackdog, Judi, etc. That is about the only time I have time. But even then, that is my read the paper and eat time.

 

I need to get some sleep sometime.

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A) among other things (selling night vision to our enemies and such), they have a short memory.

 

Fair enough, but Rumsfield falls into that category too.  Hell, he and his and Regan helped put Saddam in power because he wasn't a hardline Muslim (that sure worked out).  US companies sold weapons-grade anthrax to Saddam.  Until Iraq invaded Kuwait, Saddam was still buddies with the White House.  I'm not defending France, but damn - your own government set up a situation where they needed to send your sons and daughters to die in the sand.  I don't know that any other Iraqi leader they could have backed would have been less of a threat 25 years later but there's no getting around their involvement in creating the current situation.  That and the fact Saddam was a raving fuckin' lunatic.

 

LR - you get all the sleep you need when you're dead. :eyebrow:

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A) among other things (selling night vision to our enemies and such), they have a short memory.

 

Fair enough, but Rumsfield falls into that category too.  Hell, he and his and Regan helped put Saddam in power because he wasn't a hardline Muslim (that sure worked out).  US companies sold weapons-grade anthrax to Saddam.  Until Iraq invaded Kuwait, Saddam was still buddies with the White House.  I'm not defending France, but damn - your own government set up a situation where they needed to send your sons and daughters to die in the sand.  I don't know that any other Iraqi leader they could have backed would have been less of a threat 25 years later but there's no getting around their involvement in creating the current situation.  That and the fact Saddam was a raving fuckin' lunatic.

 

LR - you get all the sleep you need when you're dead. :eyebrow:

Different state of affairs...remember the Russians?

 

Much like tomorrow's election, we needed to pick the lesser of two evils.

:nod:

 

Now, here's what's always bothered me...why the HELL do we care who controls Arabian oil?

We have the ability to get beyond this bloody need for foreign oil.  We have the resources and intellect to start relying on "cleaner" sources of power.  Yet, we don't...

 

:tear2:

 

I'm content with the notion that there's a shit load going on behind the scenes that I don't need to know about.  It's always been that way.  Maybe it's all based loosely on the same tradelines California orange growers have with Florida Orange growers ???

 

LR isn't dead yet...just sleepwalking.

 

:bthumb:

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Warmonger???  Maybe it's just me, but the war in Iraq was supported by the senate and was actually part of a stated regime change policy (Iraq Liberation Act) dating back to the Clinton administration...

So tell me why GW went to war for WMD and not for the Iraq Liberation Act?

 

I don't know about you, but where I work i would have been canned for such gross errors.

 

 

And that tax cut, what a joke, do you really call that a tax cut?

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Now, here's what's always bothered me...why the HELL do we care who controls Arabian oil?

We have the ability to get beyond this bloody need for foreign oil.  We have the resources and intellect to start relying on "cleaner" sources of power.  Yet, we don't...

I don't get it either except I suspect those 'behind the scenes' goings-on have something to do with it.  We've all heard stories about 'devices' that allow otherwise normal vehicles to get unheard-of mileage (like 70 or 80mpg).  Now, I don't know if that's true or not but we do know for sure that the internal combustion engine is hugely inefficient.

 

Even the Arabs are moving away from reliance on oil - Saudi is rapidly developing hydrogen fuel plants and European automakers are testing hydrogen-fueled cars in the Middle East - and they aren't doing it with hideous little shit-box cars that only hardcore yippies (yuppie-hippie) are buying either, but high-end luxury sedans and sportscars.

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And that tax cut, what a joke, do you really call that a tax cut?

If I had gotten one - I would have bought a nice dinner...

 

Thanks, Danny

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I like Arnold because he rides - And is shrewd businessman.

 

If he doesn't know it/how - He simply hires the best person.

 

I hope he can turn the CA economy around before his terms are up.

 

And besides - Someone finally fucked a Kennedy...

 

Thanks, Danny

Got a surprise call from Ahhnold at 6:30 tonight- a recorded message aaasking me doo pleese vod agaaysnd Propzishun Zembde Doo! Tahank hyou!

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This is funny. This is the response the lady sent him in reply to the original post in this thread.

 

 

Kyle, I don't have time to read your bullshit (just like last time). You want to make a concise argument, fine. But I'm not going to waste my time reading through your bullshit essays.

 

 

These are people going to UCLA in a masters program. LOL

 

Like I have said on here many times. It is not the left or the right that will kill us. It is people who can only handle information given to them in 30 sec sound bites.

 

She has no time for his "bullshit" and she feels that her e-mail was a "concise argument".

 

Remember, this is here standard for a concise argument "Whatever Kerry is, he ain't worse than the warmonger, homophobic, religious zealot who wants to take away a woman's right to choose, make it CONSTITUTIONALLY illegal for same-sex marriages to take place, ban stem-cell research and continue giving the top 1% of American's tax breaks while the rest of us empty our pockets.

"

 

Again, a UCLA student that gets her information from sounds bites only. Sad, sad day. At one time universities in this country tought students how to do research to find facts and then to develope an opinion.

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... to find facts and then to develope an opinion.

:no:   The true Frenchman in Michael is coming out.

 

I've let it go before, assuming they were simply typos.

 

Please curb the Freudian-like French-speak on this here forum.  

 

Thank You.

 

:rasp:

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:nod:  :rotfl:  :nod:

 

I just did an MSN search for:  FRENCH MILITARY VICTORIES.

 

All I got was this...no shit:

 

Search: the web. Web. Images. Groups. Directory. News. No standard web pages containing all your search terms were found. Your search - french military victories - did not match any documents. Suggestions:

www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/victories.html

 

 

:bthumb:

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The Complete Military History of France

***Please note that the Web designer is not American and blaming the Web designer for America's history is illogical. Though you may critisize this oversimplified French history all you wish, blaming or threatening the Web designer is not nice.

 

We are still accepting submissions from history researchers.

Last update: October 18, 2004.

 

- Gallic Wars

- Lost. In a war whose ending foreshadows the next 2000 years of French history, France is conquered by of all things, an Italian.

 

- Hundred Years War

- Mostly lost, saved at last by female schizophrenic who inadvertently creates The First Rule of French Warfare; "France's armies are victorious only when not led by a Frenchman." Sainted.

 

- Italian Wars

- Lost. France becomes the first and only country to ever lose two wars when fighting Italians.

 

- Wars of Religion

- France goes 0-5-4 against the Huguenots

 

- Thirty Years War

- France is technically not a participant, but manages to get invaded anyway. Claims a tie on the basis that eventually the other participants started ignoring her.

 

- War of Revolution

- Tied. Frenchmen take to wearing red flowerpots as chapeaux.

 

- The Dutch War

- Tied

 

- War of the Augsburg League/King William's War/French and Indian War

- Lost, but claimed as a tie. Three ties in a row induces deluded Frogophiles the world over to label the period as the height of French military power.

 

- War of the Spanish Succession

- Lost. The War also gave the French their first taste of a Marlborough, which they have loved every since.

 

- American Revolution

- In a move that will become quite familiar to future Americans, France claims a win even though the English colonists saw far more action. This is later known as "de Gaulle Syndrome", and leads to the Second Rule of French Warfare; "France only wins when America does most of the fighting."

 

- French Revolution

- Won, primarily due the fact that the opponent was also French.

 

- The Napoleonic Wars

- Lost. Temporary victories (remember the First Rule!) due to leadership of a Corsican, who ended up being no match for a British footwear designer.

 

- The Franco-Prussian War

- Lost. Germany first plays the role of drunk Frat boy to France's ugly girl home alone on a Saturday night.

 

- World War I

- Tied and on the way to losing, France is saved by the United States. Thousands of French women find out what it's like to not only sleep with a winner, but one who doesn't call her "Fraulein." Sadly, widespread use of condoms by American forces forestalls any improvement in the French bloodline.

 

- World War II

- Lost. Conquered French liberated by the United States and Britain just as they finish learning the Horst Wessel Song.

 

- War in Indochina

- Lost. French forces plead sickness; take to bed with the Dien Bien Flu

 

- Algerian Rebellion

- Lost. Loss marks the first defeat of a western army by a Non-Turkic Muslim force since the Crusades, and produces the First Rule of Muslim Warfare; "We can always beat the French." This rule is identical to the First Rules of the Italians, Russians, Germans, English, Dutch, Spanish, Vietnamese and Esquimaux.

 

- War on Terrorism

- France, keeping in mind its recent history, surrenders to Germans and Muslims just to be safe. Attempts to surrender to Vietnamese ambassador fail after he takes refuge in a McDonald's.

 

The question for any country silly enough to count on the French should not be "Can we count on the French?", but rather "How long until France collapses?"

 

"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without an accordion. All you do is leave behind a lot of noisy baggage."

 

Or, better still, the quote from last week's Wall Street Journal: "They're there when they need you."

 

 

 

With only an hour and a half of research, Jonathan Duczkowski provided the following losses:

 

Norse invasions, 841-911.

After having their way with the French for 70 years, the Norse are bribed by a French King named Charles the Simple (really!) who gave them Normandy in return for peace. Normans proceed to become just about the only positive military bonus in France's [favour] for next 500 years.

 

Mexico, 1863-1864.

France attempts to take advantage of Mexico's weakness following its thorough thrashing by the U.S. 20 years earlier ("Halls of Montezuma"). Not surprisingly, the only unit to distinguish itself is the French Foreign Legion (consisting of, by definition, non-Frenchmen). Booted out of the country a little over a year after arrival.

 

Panama jungles 1881-1890.

No one but nature to fight, France still loses; canal is eventually built by the U.S. 1904-1914.

 

Napoleonic Wars.

Should be noted that the Grand Armee was largely (~%50) composed of non-Frenchmen after 1804 or so. Mainly disgruntled minorities and anti-monarchists. Not surprisingly, these performed better than the French on many occasions.

 

Haiti, 1791-1804.

French defeated by rebellion after sacrificing 4,000 Poles to yellow fever. Shows another rule of French warfare; when in doubt, send an ally.

 

India, 1673-1813.

British were far more charming then French, ended up victors. Therefore the British are well known for their tea, and the French for their whine (er, wine...). Ensures 200 years of bad teeth in England.

 

Barbary Wars, middle ages-1830.

Pirates in North Africa continually harass European shipping in Meditteranean. France's solution: pay them to leave us alone. America's solution: kick their asses ("the Shores of Tripoli"). [America's] first overseas victories, won 1801-1815.

 

1798-1801, Quasi-War with U.S.

French privateers (semi-legal pirates) attack U.S. shipping. U.S. fights France at sea for 3 years; French eventually cave; sets precedent for next 200 years of Franco-American relations.

 

Moors in Spain, late 700s-early 800s.

Even with Charlemagne leading them against an enemy living in a hostile land, French are unable to make much progress. Hide behind Pyrennes until the modern day.

 

French-on-French losses (probably should be counted as victories too, just to be fair):

 

1208: Albigenses Crusade, French massacared by French.

When asked how to differentiate a heretic from the faithful, response was "Kill them all. God will know His own." Lesson: French are badasses when fighting unarmed men, women and children.

 

St. Bartholomew Day Massacre, August 24, 1572.

Once again, French-on-French slaughter.

 

Third Crusade.

Philip Augustus of France throws hissy-fit, leaves Crusade for Richard the Lion Heart to finish.

 

Seventh Crusade.

St. Louis of France leads Crusade to Egypt. Resoundingly crushed.

 

[Eighth] Crusade.

St. Louis back in action, this time in Tunis. See Seventh Crusade.

 

Also should be noted that France attempted to hide behind the Maginot line, sticking their head in the sand and pretending that the Germans would enter France that way. By doing so, the Germans would have been breaking with their traditional route of invading France, entering through Belgium (Napoleonic Wars, Franco-Prussian War, World War I, etc.). French ignored this though, and put all their effort into these defenses.

 

Last updated: October 18, 2004.

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