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http://news.msn.com/...ollar16-billion

 

I would like to know how this information was gathered, but if even close to reality it is suprising. What I'd like to see is the average cost of accidents with and without helmets and other protective gear.

 

"In 2010, 82,000 motorcyclists were injured and 4,502 were killed in crashes, the report said. The average cost for a fatal crash was estimated at $1.2 million, while the cost for injuries ranged from $2,500 to $1.4 million depending upon the severity"

 

The 1.2 million, is that for medical care or does that include economic loss???

Edited by Blu
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Statistics can be manipulated a hundred diff' ways. I've read articles where the author pointed out the helmet gave a higher risk of injury in some cases. How they can put a $ figure on some of these accidents is BS

 

I'd like to see stat's on how many accidents are due to the fault of the driver of the cages in motorcycle vs Auto accidents. How may of these cages caused accidents were alcohol related.. or ... related to texting or other distractions.

 

That all being said... though I believe in 'no helmet ' laws... .how humorous is it that in a vehicle you have to wear a seat belt even though you have all that protection from the metal.. and now air bags, but we've successfully kept helmet laws at bay in many states?

 

I've ridden for 27 years ... even sold my bike back in '95 due to TX having helmet laws back then ( when they got rid of the law, I bought another bike ) ..... yet... in the last month decided to start wearing a lid. Finally found one that fits good, doesn't look like a mushroom on the noggin' , and I trust it to take a hit ( and no.. it's not a full face.. that would make sense)

 

Getting back to the orig subject... these articles are bullshit .. IMHO

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It actually sounds pretty accurate, in spite of Mark Twains'quote about "Lies, damn lies and statistics".

(Rick's right, you can pretty much find a way to slant almost any statistics to 'prove' whatever you want.)

 

However, it is extremely damn expensive.

 

Let me give you a quick rundown on my expenses for my 'little' accident, that you "could hardly tell the bike had been down".

 

Motorcycle repair expenses on the Chief: Over $9,500.

 

Current medical expenses:

 

Ambulance ride from BFE: $1600.

 

Hospital expenses, including CT scans and X rays: $7,000.

 

Physician's expenses(Radiologist who read the CT scans of my head and internal organs, and the Xrays of all my scuffed up extremities, the Emergency physicians fees, and the Orthopedist for my broken hand): $2000.

 

Prescriptions' Lab work and Wound care on my 3rd degree road rash, including a multitude of bandages that had to be changed twice a day for three months: roughly $900

 

Still in progress:

MRI of my right knee: $900

Repair of my right medial meniscus tear and torn ACL, including postop physical therapy and rehab: roughly $10,000.

TIme off work: (I am not on salary. ER docs get paid by the shift. If I don't work, I don't get paid): yet to be determined.

Let's just say 'expensive'.

 

 

Mental anguish my poor pregnant wife had, viewing me hit the car, and tumbling down the highway, and therapy for all my friends who saw it too:

Priceless. I will be hearing about this for the rest of my life.

 

So.

Total for my 'little' accident?

 

$30,000+.

 

Minimum.

 

Had I not been wearing a helmet?

Well, the medical expenses would have been zero, since the impact of my head on that bumper would have punched my ticket right then and there...but the cost would have been astronomical.

I have one million dollar life insurance policy with MG as beneficiary, and another for the kids, so there's two million right there, and then my lost income for basically the rest of my life. Expensive.

 

My view on this remains that you should have the right to ride without a helmet if you wish, just sign a donor agreement, and off you go.

 

Of course, I also believe that the government has no goddamn business telling you what to do with your body, or what you put in your body, as long as it doesn't involve danger or injury to others, children or farm animals.

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If I can let me add to Dr. Marks "sign a donor agreemeent and off you go". Doing a hazardous activity like riding a motorcycle is our right. Doing a hazardous activity without due precautions is just stupid. So if you want to ride without a helmet, great. Then waive out of Social security disability, welfare and other public assistance for the family that you may you leave without support. Buy private life insurance and disability to cover yourself. Your life, your decisons, but everyone else's wallet. Dont tell anyone you dont want the goverment to tell you what to do knowing they will cover you if you screw up.

 

Another example, if you go mountain climbing and fall, you should be rescued. If you go mountian climbing without sufficent gear, without a plan, and without the proper skills, you should be rescued and then given a bill for the expenses.

 

So I think, bash away!

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If I can let me add to Dr. Marks "sign a donor agreemeent and off you go". Doing a hazardous activity like riding a motorcycle is our right. Doing a hazardous activity without due precautions is just stupid. So if you want to ride without a helmet, great. Then waive out of Social security disability, welfare and other public assistance for the family that you may you leave without support. Buy private life insurance and disability to cover yourself. Your life, your decisons, but everyone else's wallet. Dont tell anyone you dont want the goverment to tell you what to do knowing they will cover you if you screw up.

 

Another example, if you go mountain climbing and fall, you should be rescued. If you go mountian climbing without sufficent gear, without a plan, and without the proper skills, you should be rescued and then given a bill for the expenses.

 

So I think, bash away!

 

For those of us who have contributed significantly to the GOV, why can't we have both, Blu?!

 

Also, many of these so-called statistical studies and subsequent news articles are from the pro-insurance side of the isle. Why do you think seatbelt laws, texting laws, etc., have been implemented in most, if not all, of the states? Think: INSURANCE LOBBY-->it saves them millions of dollars, as do mandatory helmet laws. Don't think for a minute they are enacted in any large part to "protect" us. While those laws may protect us, protecting us was not the motivating factor behind the legislation.

 

Peace out!!

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Said it before and saying it again. "Dick" Durbin always pushed for a helmet law in Illinois. Did it have anything to do with the fact that Bell helmet was in his district. One word that covers mandatory laws---- LOBBISTS.. LOBBISTS..LOBBISTS!! You change things by education. Do you think a helmet will help when bobo the chimp hits you while texting. or phoning. or putting on their make up?

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For those of us who have contributed significantly to the GOV, why can't we have both, Blu?!

 

Also, many of these so-called statistical studies and subsequent news articles are from the pro-insurance side of the isle. Why do you think seatbelt laws, texting laws, etc., have been implemented in most, if not all, of the states? Think: INSURANCE LOBBY-->it saves them millions of dollars, as do mandatory helmet laws. Don't think for a minute they are enacted in any large part to "protect" us. While those laws may protect us, protecting us was not the motivating factor behind the legislation.

 

Peace out!!

 

Contibuting and then setting yourself up to collect is in nobodys best interest. So your argument is I am going to make it more likely to hurt myself so I can get the gov't benefits I deserve? Texting laws are a no-brainer, ever had anyone drift into your lane because of texting, come on, really? I think texting while driving should be a mandatory 30 day driving suspension. As far as seatbelt laws go, I dont care why the laws are in effect. They have saved many thousands of lives, so much evidence about that disputing it is just silly at this point. Ask anyone who has ever worked in an emergency room or a cop. If me not flying thru the windsheild saves the insurance company money, well so be it. Everyone's premium will be less too.

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Do you think a helmet will help when bobo the chimp hits you while texting. or phoning. or putting on their make up?

 

In a word, YES.

 

When Bimbo the Teenage Idiot pulls out in from of me, I may have multiple fractures, contusions, abrasions and lacerations, but at least I won't a drooling, pissing, shitting vegetable on a ventilator in one of the numerous long-term-care vent facilities that are scattered across the country.

 

Visit one sometime. It's a memorable experience. Take a barf bag.

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Same as at a Vet Hospital. Everything has its price to do or to participate in. To get to be old and wise, you have had to be young,dumb, and stupid I'm still waiting to be the the first one!

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It actually sounds pretty accurate, in spite of Mark Twains'quote about "Lies, damn lies and statistics".

(Rick's right, you can pretty much find a way to slant almost any statistics to 'prove' whatever you want.)

 

However, it is extremely damn expensive.

 

Let me give you a quick rundown on my expenses for my 'little' accident, that you "could hardly tell the bike had been down".

 

Motorcycle repair expenses on the Chief: Over $9,500.

 

Current medical expenses:

 

Ambulance ride from BFE: $1600.

 

Hospital expenses, including CT scans and X rays: $7,000.

 

Physician's expenses(Radiologist who read the CT scans of my head and internal organs, and the Xrays of all my scuffed up extremities, the Emergency physicians fees, and the Orthopedist for my broken hand): $2000.

 

Prescriptions' Lab work and Wound care on my 3rd degree road rash, including a multitude of bandages that had to be changed twice a day for three months: roughly $900

 

Still in progress:

MRI of my right knee: $900

Repair of my right medial meniscus tear and torn ACL, including postop physical therapy and rehab: roughly $10,000.

TIme off work: (I am not on salary. ER docs get paid by the shift. If I don't work, I don't get paid): yet to be determined.

Let's just say 'expensive'.

 

 

Mental anguish my poor pregnant wife had, viewing me hit the car, and tumbling down the highway, and therapy for all my friends who saw it too:

Priceless. I will be hearing about this for the rest of my life.

 

So.

Total for my 'little' accident?

 

$30,000+.

 

Minimum.

 

Had I not been wearing a helmet?

Well, the medical expenses would have been zero, since the impact of my head on that bumper would have punched my ticket right then and there...but the cost would have been astronomical.

I have one million dollar life insurance policy with MG as beneficiary, and another for the kids, so there's two million right there, and then my lost income for basically the rest of my life. Expensive.

 

My view on this remains that you should have the right to ride without a helmet if you wish, just sign a donor agreement, and off you go.

 

Of course, I also believe that the government has no goddamn business telling you what to do with your body, or what you put in your body, as long as it doesn't involve danger or injury to others, children or farm animals.

You say that you "could hardly tell the bike had been down" but your injuries were OBVIOUS and yet these days it costs nearly as much to fix motorized vehicles as it does to fix our own bodies. Everything is just too damn expensive these days. And, I didn't win the Powerball (GASP!) so I guess I'll move in with the Amish so I can get out of SS and actually have a community that supports themselves in just about every way (just have to deal with no electricity and really bad haircuts).

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Contibuting and then setting yourself up to collect is in nobodys best interest. So your argument is I am going to make it more likely to hurt myself so I can get the gov't benefits I deserve? Texting laws are a no-brainer, ever had anyone drift into your lane because of texting, come on, really? I think texting while driving should be a mandatory 30 day driving suspension. As far as seatbelt laws go, I dont care why the laws are in effect. They have saved many thousands of lives, so much evidence about that disputing it is just silly at this point. Ask anyone who has ever worked in an emergency room or a cop. If me not flying thru the windsheild saves the insurance company money, well so be it. Everyone's premium will be less too.

 

My post wasn't meant to argumentative-->just adding some info. @"Setting yourself up to collect"-->I don't see it that way. The only way that happens is if I don't wear a helmet/seatbelt and I make poor decisions and cause or am responsible for my own accident. If someone else makes a mistake and causes me to be in an accident, I can't help that, but they could by not violating whatever law they violated to cause the accident (such as failure to yield, going over center line, speeding, DUI, etc.). So "setting myself up" is more like failing to take precautionary measures against what might be someone else's mistake, but yet I am still not allowed to collect the very benefits that are designated for those types of things?! I just can't go there. Now, if I cause my own accident/injuries, then I can see it.

 

Also, I have seen many accidents, seatbelt use and non, and, yes, no question the wearing of seatbelts have prevented more serious injuries than they have caused--same likely goes for helmets as well.

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I do wish people would quit trying to tell me how I need to live my life. When you depend on others to take care of you, you don't have the luxury of controlling their activities. Insurance is exactly that. You are pooling your money with other people to cover a contributors bad fortune. If there is picking and choosing to be done, do that before you accept their money. Truth is, most of us are not as great as we think we are. If we are gonna start culling people from the pool, let's cut people who are abusing prescription drugs, people who smoke, people who drink, people who scuba dive, people who mountain climb, people who hunt, people who use recreational drugs, people who are fat, people who have have illnesses because of lifestyle choices, farmers, loggers, and all the other hazardous occupations that they chose. Pretty soon you don't have a pool. You are self sustaining. Maybe the way it should be.

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Truly, ed, there is an argument for that as well. Darwin at work...

Absolutely right. Probably gonna be the future. Probably the best way. Maybe we all need a reality check. Darwin works best for animals that don't prepare and adapt. You don't have to be dumb or wreckless. Lazy will get you just as fast.
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I do wish people would quit trying to tell me how I need to live my life. When you depend on others to take care of you, you don't have the luxury of controlling their activities. Insurance is exactly that. You are pooling your money with other people to cover a contributors bad fortune. If there is picking and choosing to be done, do that before you accept their money. Truth is, most of us are not as great as we think we are. If we are gonna start culling people from the pool, let's cut people who are abusing prescription drugs, people who smoke, people who drink, people who scuba dive, people who mountain climb, people who hunt, people who use recreational drugs, people who are fat, people who have have illnesses because of lifestyle choices, farmers, loggers, and all the other hazardous occupations that they chose. Pretty soon you don't have a pool. You are self sustaining. Maybe the way it should be.

 

Cull people out, no. Ask those who take are at high risk for one reason or another to pay more, yes. I dont want my premium to be more because of someone who smokes and it trying to eat themselves to death. This would make the system fair for all. Just thinking all should take responsibility for their choices. My opinion, nothing more.

 

I say this knowing that if the motorcycle doesn't kill me, then Mountian biking or skiing like an idiot will. At least with windsurfing they are not likely to find my body. However I have helmets for every sport and am not reckless. I also have private disability insurance, I expect no one to cover my ass for my risk taking.

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Cull people out, no. Ask those who take are at high risk for one reason or another to pay more, yes. I dont want my premium to be more because of someone who smokes and it trying to eat themselves to death. This would make the system fair for all. Just thinking all should take responsibility for their choices. My opinion, nothing more.

 

I say this knowing that if the motorcycle doesn't kill me, then Mountian biking or skiing like an idiot will. At least with windsurfing they are not likely to find my body. However I have helmets for every sport and am not reckless. I also have private disability insurance, I expect no one to cover my ass for my risk taking.

All that you say you do is risky in the eyes of insurers. What you are suggesting is private individual health insurance. Everybody is grouped together with others with same health. Problem is..about 75% of the people couldn't even qualify without riders and exclusions. Also the smaller subgroups make it hard to hold premiums when some of the members of your subgroup run up big bills. The people with few claims pay the claims for the people with many. like I said, most of us aren't as good a risk as we think we are. We also can't predict the future. Despite best efforts, we all get sick and die.
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Bly... As Eddie says.... We are paying for risky activities... Your activities get lumped in with non-risky insured and our rates are affected... It's all circular Happy... We all pay for each other... If I'm forced to where a helmet maybe you should be forced to not mountain bike or ski... Maybe you should be limited to just one risky activity... Nah... I read Orwell... Didn't like it....I don't like being controlled...

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Bly... As Eddie says.... We are paying for risky activities... Your activities get lumped in with non-risky insured and our rates are affected... It's all circular Happy... We all pay for each other... If I'm forced to where a helmet maybe you should be forced to not mountain bike or ski... Maybe you should be limited to just one risky activity... Nah... I read Orwell... Didn't like it....I don't like being controlled...

 

I dont have a problem with activities that could be considered "risky". What I have a problem with is not exercising due care and THEN expecting someone else ( us all) to pick up the tab. Skiing, not that risky considering the number of people who ski, ski jumping or racing, a whole diferrent thing. I dont like anyone to tell me what to do either, if you met me that would be apparent. I think the goverment should be totally out of the lifestyle enforcement business. However, everyone should then have to take responsiblity for their personal choices. Someone elses poor choices shouldn't cost me, you, or anyone else. Helmets are just one small factor in this. If someones choices cost me then they just took away my free choice on what I have to pay for. All I was saying. This extends to many things, I dont like it that my state taxes are so frekin high because of someone else's choice to be a lazy ass and not work. All the same concept. Nuff said. Maybe I'll get down south one of these days and we can duke it out over drinks. :Beer-Chug[1]: Bet we are closer on this than is coming out here. What was that saying about arguing online?

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You should be DAMN GLAD he didn't mention "HOBBIT"

 

I'm way fat and way lazy.... so maybe I can get a pass on hobbit..... :grin:

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