Dull Afternoon

[KenB]

It's a dull day at work.

 

So I’ve done all I can this week, set up everything for the weekend sales, and now here I sit with an hour and a half before it will be time to go home. Anything I start will take longer than the hour and a half left to me, so now I’m sitting here pondering what changes would I make to the Indian Chief design if I had the power, knowledge, and license to do so?

 

My Darkhorse is a beautiful bike with a definite nostalgic leaning. How would I change it so it would appear modern and nostalgic at the same time?

 

• I would leave the current PP-105 engine where it is, just fix the problems it has. The top of that list would be the ECM issue obviously. Oh yeah, also the oil filter location.
• If possible I would use the Victory primary and transmission. The Victory primary is gear driven, bullet proof and needs no adjusting. Just keep the fluids changed and you’re good to go.
• I would look into developing a shaft drive for the final drive. This would open up more back (dirt and gravel) roads that tend to chew our current final drive belts to pieces.
• I would lower the suspension so more “inseam impaired” riders would feel comfortable on it.
• I would modify the frame giving it a double back bone much like the Harley VRSC models, and move the induction into an air box above the engine designed to look much like the current fuel tank but with intake vent holes at the front.
• I would then move the fuel tank below the rider seat, lowering the center of gravity.
• I would definitely leave the big fenders exactly as they are. Everything I would do with styling would be in the style of Art Decco.

That’s about it.

 

I really like the Indian Chief 841 though. I certainly think it would be worth studying customer reaction to the transverse mounted engine.

 

Yeah I’m bored. And all that just killed about 8 minutes. I’ve got a long time to go before I can get out of here. I’m looking forward to a good weekend of riding in some (finally) warm weather.

 

So what would YOU do as far as changes to the Chief, or if you want talk about the Scout / Spirit you'd build. Maybe someone else is having a dull day.

 

 

 

 

 

[darkrider]

those are some interesting ideas, ken.

don't forget about it needing to be a automatic and needing less fringe

 

I hate to say it, but I agree on the shaft drive part. for a cruiser, I just don't see what could be better than shaft drive as far as from a maintance and reliability standpoint.

 

I also have done a complete 180 since I first heard polaris bought Indian, on what kind of Indian they should build.

for the chiefs... keep some kind of big fender reminescant of the obvious, but don't copy so close like the gilroys and springfield indians. and certainly don't copy so much of the gilroy era at all.

Come up with a whole new Indian. put the best of the best on it. don't make it a air cooled v-twin either. move forward. if they don't sell... they can always change it.

 

my opinion on this is subject to change from one day to the next though

[KenB]

1332726005[/url]' post='528331']

those are some interesting ideas, ken.

don't forget about it needing to be a automatic and needing less fringe

 

I hate to say it, but I agree on the shaft drive part. for a cruiser, I just don't see what could be better than shaft drive as far as from a maintance and reliability standpoint.

 

I also have done a complete 180 since I first heard polaris bought Indian, on what kind of Indian they should build.

for the chiefs... keep some kind of big fender reminescant of the obvious, but don't copy so close like the gilroys and springfield indians. and certainly don't copy so much of the gilroy era at all.

Come up with a whole new Indian. put the best of the best on it. don't make it a air cooled v-twin either. move forward. if they don't sell... they can always change it.

 

my opinion on this is subject to change from one day to the next though

 

Harley's liquid cooled bike is a non starter in terms of sales, we can't hardly give them away.

I prefer Victory's approach of using air and oil (5-6 quarts) for cooling.

No automatic... But I would go with TBW because it makes cruise control easier.

Actually I would like to see an around the world endurance run. Show potential customers that Indian makes a strong and durable bike. Capture their imagination, not to compete with BMW in adventure riding as I would plot the course on paved roads as much as possible. Make some noise and get the brand known and talked about.

[Brock]

same basic look but a new bike from ground up so NOBODY can say it is a Harley clone or Victory clone or any fucking clone.... downside is parts will be harder to come by on the road but Polaris is big enough they should not be going under from financials anytime soon in my lifetime.

 

Keep at least one model with the fully valenced fenders we now associate with our modern Chiefs....the retro styling and nostalgia included.

 

Come up with a new motor...not an EVO, an XWedge, a Flathead, or Victory...something new with 105-112 cubic inches.......with an air-oil cooled motor to meet EPA regulations...stay away from the liquid cooled. 6 speed transmission with old school air cleaner still but all the modern designs to offer performance of 100 ft lbs of torgue at least with fuel economy in 40s. Something retro Indian in style with modern styling queues and performance.

 

Keep the mono shock for handling and clean looks at rear of bike...figure out more streamline exhaust to capture need for Cat Conv....and move oil filter somewhere more accessible.

 

Not sure about keeping Primary and all one unit....I think Indian had that design in the beginning actually....but more concerned about quality, smooth ride, reliable power and durability than style as long as it fits overall theme of bike and is proportionate.

 

 

That would be the Chief model...

 

Would also like a Scout model that is a smaller quicker maybe modernized cafe racer/runabout style.....for the speed freaks.

 

Maybe a big 4cyl or something for a long distance touring bike....

 

Then follow Triumph model and bring in some modern sport and touring models, dirt bike, etc.....

 

For the Chief.....I love the Gilroy and KM styling.....and KM got most of the quirks out of the old Gilroy design...I would say 98% of the problems are gone compared to Gilroy. Either refine what they have more and keep it moving forward... Or completely go back to the basics and come out with a TRULY UNIQUE AND INDIAN MOTORCYCLE that stands on its own.

 

My 4 cents.

[KenB]

A lot of good points there, and a lot of (in my opinion) really good ideas.

 

I would like to see Indian move the design forward. Better technology, better performance, better economy where possible. Harley has not changed their basic design i a very long time because without competition they haven't had the need to. I see this as an opportunity for Indian to regain the reputation as innovators and get out from under the umbrella of the "harley clone" tag.

[darkrider]

are the over-all sales of v-rods across the globe down?

I remember when they first came out. I thought they where cool, but didn't do anything for me. I remember as soon as it came out, all the brands from the rice-pond came out with their copy of it.

[hasbin]

I wouldn't mind seeing them oil cooled, I don't think you could move the fuel tank any other place than where it is because of the volume needed, I have a GL-1000 that has the tank (small) in that position & It don't hold much fuel (it does get around 50mpg though) so you can get a few miles on a tank. I am of the opinion the primary as cool as it is & fairly easey to change or repair trans. Now if they make a bullet-proof trans. I have now prob with a trans in the case. I don't think we will ever see an INDIAN dirt bike or even a dual purpose because the the Boyz from the land of rice have them as close to perfect as one could want & not worth the $$ it would take to R&D

 

There you have it...My .02

[KenB]

1332817122[/url]' post='528404']

I wouldn't mind seeing them oil cooled, I don't think you could move the fuel tank any other place than where it is because of the volume needed, I have a GL-1000 that has the tank (small) in that position & It don't hold much fuel (it does get around 50mpg though) so you can get a few miles on a tank. I am of the opinion the primary as cool as it is & fairly easey to change or repair trans. Now if they make a bullet-proof trans. I have now prob with a trans in the case. I don't think we will ever see an INDIAN dirt bike or even a dual purpose because the the Boyz from the land of rice have them as close to perfect as one could want & not worth the $ it would take to R&D

 

There you have it...My .02

 

The VRSC bikes have a 5 gallon tank under the seat. There's more volume than you think down there.

Sales of the "V-Rod" are low pretty much across the US, but that's only from observation and conversations I've had. As far as Europe, I don't know. Originally the design was intended to attract younger customers, but from what I've seen the design was wide of the mark. At my dealer we've sold maybe 2 in the last 6 months.