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and what do you suggest they provide for young folks just starting out in life?...

 

and do you suggest that our "Goverment" step in and restructure Harley Davidson to make them a more "People Friendly" corporation,,???

 

Those are your words, not mine, Jim.

 

whatamaroon.jpg

 

Have some more Elton John Champagne with your deluded HD buds why doncha?

 

 

:Feet-Up[1]:

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Those are your words, not mine, Jim.

 

whatamaroon.jpg

 

Have some more Elton John Champagne with your deluded HD buds why doncha?

 

 

:Feet-Up[1]:

And whats wrong with Elton John?....

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Sure, People still buy from HD ~ just whip out the plastic!

 

Still, HD management is part & parcel of what is wrong with American Corporate structure today and like most are not providing much opportunity for young folks just starting out in life.

 

Corporations have all the rights of American People yet share fewer responsibilities and liabilities due to their structure and special interest loopholes that their bought and bribed lackeys in government provide.

Shit, if the young folks want a motorcycle, they can buy a Sportster for short coin. They also provide entry level union jobs for the young folk too. What more should they do?

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What more should they do?

 

 

they need to be providing more[like a buttload more]

$45/hr basic assembly line jobs

at 44-60 hours a week

 

 

THAT'L keep production costs in check...

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yaaawn. I'm no Harley Fan, but seriously some folks act like they owe us something? Good that their production is up, and still people bitch that they make too much profit? That's the kind of marxist crap that's getting America in deep shit right now. Harley answers to shareholders, period. Luckily for them, millions of sheep still buy their boring bikes...good for them. We should all be happy a company is prospering in this dismal economy...and hope more companies can do better, instead of asking what they can do for us, or insisting they owe us something....pathetic.

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yaaawn. I'm no Harley Fan, but seriously some folks act like they owe us something? Good that their production is up, and still people bitch that they make too much profit? That's the kind of marxist crap that's getting America in deep shit right now. Harley answers to shareholders, period. Luckily for them, millions of sheep still buy their boring bikes...good for them. We should all be happy a company is prospering in this dismal economy...and hope more companies can do better, instead of asking what they can do for us, or insisting they owe us something....pathetic.

 

 

Egg Zachery,,,,,,,,,,,,

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yaaawn. I'm no Harley Fan, but seriously some folks act like they owe us something? Good that their production is up, and still people bitch that they make too much profit? That's the kind of marxist crap that's getting America in deep shit right now. Harley answers to shareholders, period. Luckily for them, millions of sheep still buy their boring bikes...good for them. We should all be happy a company is prospering in this dismal economy...and hope more companies can do better, instead of asking what they can do for us, or insisting they owe us something....pathetic.

 

TC,

 

Your 'red bait' ass owns a business, yet you speak of gun rights and goverment run amuck? :P

 

I don't have anything against HD showing higher profits...It's just that it is slight of hand Houdini trick of firing half the workforce to polish the apple for potential new stock sales. The Stock was down a year ago now it's up again. Just doesn't show real growth when half the people making the product disappear. Now they are opening new factories in China & India.

 

The Big Picture is beyond just Harley Davidson...a corporation doing well ~ people well off still buying toys, OK but look at the rest of the country.

 

All fat & happy with a corporate bought & run government ~ job exporting ~ economy deflating by design ~ police state to control the malconents and disenfranchised, are we? Just saying if you were fresh out of high school or college and needed to flip burgers, camp out in the park and watch every cent...the outlook is bleak for those looking for work and not finding much early in life.

 

It's become a "government of the schucks, by the schmucks and for the schmucks" while ordinary citizens will be charged for 'frivolous complaints'.

 

As far as the 'debt ceiling' goes, tax the FED for the last 100 years at 15 trillion, and a trillion a year every year from now on for the job priviledge of 'creating' our currency out of imaginary debt.

 

Or just end the FED and start issuing US made greenbacks ~ grow the Repulic & economy from new roots unsullied by those who control the present scene.

 

Pull into an HD dealership and see how they react to servicing your Shovel or Pan. Harley is part & parcel of the corporate nightmare that is screwing everything up. Not a big player but image-wise a huge cultural player none the less.

 

As a Marine, I thank you for your service, as a small business owner, I thought you would show more sense & consistency of expressed thought.

 

The Tea Party movement had high hopes of being a true 3rd party till it was taken over by NeoCon Repulicants. Now that most of the founders have been ignored and delegitamized it is just an echo of Republicant status quo keeping agenda.

 

Maybe the best way to get our Repub & Democrat reps to a reality check is for us to vote for anyone else but them.

 

The voting populace probably won't wake up till the bubble bursts and life kicks 'em in their fat ass ~ if they survive the kick that is. Even then blame & destruction will be deflected onto some harmless bystander group if history serves as a primer.

 

End of rant. :Beer-Chug[1]::Cheers[1]: Have a beer ~ I'm buyin'.

Edited by Doc Loco
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TC,

 

Your 'red bait' ass owns a business, yet you speak of gun rights and goverment run amuck? :P

 

Uuuh...yes I do...I'm all about less government control of my businss and my rights protected by the constitution.[/b]

 

 

I don't have anything against HD showing higher profits...It's just that it is slight of hand Houdini trick of firing half the workforce to polish the apple for potential new stock sales. The Stock was down a year ago now it's up again. Just doesn't show real growth when half the people making the product disappear. Now they are opening new factories in China & India.

 

No doubt it's slight of hand, and I would imagine most serious investors understand that...but, production is production, and in this dire economy, I'd be thrilled to show some type of profit. I think that's the real issue...so many people think "Profit" is some evil word...it's not....profit is good, it means they create a product that people want.

 

The Big Picture is beyond just Harley Davidson...a corporation doing well ~ people well off still buying toys, OK but look at the rest of the country.

 

All fat & happy with a corporate bought & run government ~ job exporting ~ economy deflating by design ~ police state to control the malconents and disenfranchised, are we? Just saying if you were fresh out of high school or college and needed to flip burgers, camp out in the park and watch every cent...the outlook is bleak for those looking for work and not finding much early in life.

 

now THIS I agree with...Corporate cronyism is wrong...thus, why I'd never buy a GM or Chrysler again, nor would I invest in AIG...but, put the blame where it really belongs...OUR GOVERNMENT. The Corps are just playing the cards their dealt...our government (the only entity that can coerce) is the one setting the rules, and using selective payoffs based on back-scratching...Bailouts are wrong and unconstitutional period...and are destroying the fabric of this nation, because yes, small business are the ones that get stuck with the bill, and it pisses me off.

 

It's become a "government of the schucks, by the schmucks and for the schmucks" while ordinary citizens will be charged for 'frivolous complaints'.

Agreed

 

As far as the 'debt ceiling' goes, tax the FED for the last 100 years at 15 trillion, and a trillion a year every year from now on for the job priviledge of 'creating' our currency out of imaginary debt.

 

Or just end the FED and start issuing US made greenbacks ~ grow the Repulic & economy from new roots unsullied by those who control the present scene.

Agreed.

 

Pull into an HD dealership and see how they react to servicing your Shovel or Pan. Harley is part & parcel of the corporate nightmare that is screwing everything up. Not a big player but image-wise a huge cultural player none the less.

 

You won't find me pulling into Harley Dealerships...too many sheep.

 

As a Marine, I thank you for your service, as a small business owner, I thought you would show more sense & consistency of expressed thought.

 

 

Sorry I seem nonsensical to you...I think I'm pretty logical myself, but I'm biased, lol.

 

The Tea Party movement had high hopes of being a true 3rd party till it was taken over by NeoCon Repulicants. Now that most of the founders have been ignored and delegitamized it is just an echo of Republicant status quo keeping agenda.

 

Maybe the best way to get our Repub & Democrat reps to a reality check is for us to vote for anyone else but them.

 

I got Ron Paul in my sights as the best Candidate running...He really is Libertarian at heart, and has integrity and respects the Constitution. He's the ONLY Republican I'd vote for.

 

The voting populace probably won't wake up till the bubble bursts and life kicks 'em in their fat ass ~ if they survive the kick that is. Even then blame & destruction will be deflected onto some harmless bystander group if history serves as a primer.

 

End of rant. :Beer-Chug[1]::Cheers[1]: Have a beer ~ I'm buyin'.

 

 

Cheers, and hope to meet you one day...

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Pull into an HD dealership and see how they react to servicing your Shovel or Pan.

Pull into any automobile dealership and see how they react to servicing a car made in the 1940' or 1950's. Same thing...

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I'd love to see some of you run a business.

If you produced 500 widgets a day with 50 employees on the production line

Suddenly the demand for you product drops to 200 per day, not a temp drop but one that is at least permanent for the foreseeable future.

You would keep all 50 employees? And expect to remain in business and be able to employee anyone?

 

The best data I could find for Harley is; Click Here

2006 = 349,196

2010 = 210, 494

 

That is just about a 40% drop in production.

 

And note that overseas sales have gone from just under 76,000 to just under 78,000 units. There was a good bump on the years they entered the new markets but it seems those bike were shipped to dealers but not sold based on the lowered shipments in the following years. So they have expanded their markets but are not increasing their sales there yet.

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Doc Loco, on 29 July 2011 - 12:27 PM, said:

 

 

Pull into an HD dealership and see how they react to servicing your Shovel or Pan.

 

 

 

 

Pull into any automobile dealership and see how they react to servicing a car made in the 1940' or 1950's. Same thing...

 

 

 

Those who own a Shovel or a Pan,, Do their own wrenching,, If ya wanna ride it ,,you learn to fix it,,

at least the guys I ride with,,, who own 40+ year old Harleys

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Doc Loco, on 29 July 2011 - 12:27 PM, said:

 

 

Pull into an HD dealership and see how they react to servicing your Shovel or Pan.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Those who own a Shovel or a Pan,, Do their own wrenching,, If ya wanna ride it ,,you learn to fix it,,

at least the guys I ride with,,, who own 40+ year old Harleys

 

Sounds familiar somehow... :Cheers[1]:

 

 

:Feet-Up[1]:

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I'd love to see some of you run a business.

If you produced 500 widgets a day with 50 employees on the production line

Suddenly the demand for you product drops to 200 per day, not a temp drop but one that is at least permanent for the foreseeable future.

You would keep all 50 employees? And expect to remain in business and be able to employee anyone?

 

The best data I could find for Harley is; Click Here

2006 = 349,196

2010 = 210, 494

 

That is just about a 40% drop in production.

 

 

:Score-101010[1]::I-Agree[1]: I have also had to reduce my workforce and take cuts in my salary to keep afloat. Scales of economy are still the same...we have a giant shit sandwhich, thanks to Keynesian big-government spending and the entitlement mentality, and no matter how much we beg the government to do something, they can't fix it....they never could, because they only know how to spend money, make backroom deals, and force us to do stuff in the name of "the greater good". America is in deep shit, and It will never get better. I feel lucky AND cursed...I got to live in a time of great prosperity and technology...yet I have to watch a once great country fall to it's kneees because of greedy, over-entitled douchebags that think they are owed something other than the product of their own mind. No one questioned the stimulus, the crony-capitalism bailouts, cash for clunkers, and a "peacenik" preseident that kept gitmo and all the wars going, and even started a new one in Libya, even as out economy is tanking... Nothing I can do but buy ammo, food, and have a good fall out plan when the inevitable shit hits the fan. Meanwhile, I'll continue to work hard,and try to change what I can, and fight for the Constitution...but I'm losing this battle...we all are. Hate to sound like the crazy Australian dude, but it is what it is. We can sit an aruge over petty stuff, like Harley versus Indian versus Polaris, but fact is there are MUCH bigger things happening which make all of this irrelevant, and it's heart-breaking.

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:Score-101010[1]::I-Agree[1]: I have also had to reduce my workforce and take cuts in my salary to keep afloat. Scales of economy are still the same...we have a giant shit sandwhich, thanks to Keynesian big-government spending and the entitlement mentality, and no matter how much we beg the government to do something, they can't fix it....they never could, because they only know how to spend money, make backroom deals, and force us to do stuff in the name of "the greater good". America is in deep shit, and It will never get better. I feel lucky AND cursed...I got to live in a time of great prosperity and technology...yet I have to watch a once great country fall to it's kneees because of greedy, over-entitled douchebags that think they are owed something other than the product of their own mind. No one questioned the stimulus, the crony-capitalism bailouts, cash for clunkers, and a "peacenik" preseident that kept gitmo and all the wars going, and even started a new one in Libya, even as out economy is tanking... Nothing I can do but buy ammo, food, and have a good fall out plan when the inevitable shit hits the fan. Meanwhile, I'll continue to work hard,and try to change what I can, and fight for the Constitution...but I'm losing this battle...we all are. Hate to sound like the crazy Australian dude, but it is what it is. We can sit an aruge over petty stuff, like Harley versus Indian versus Polaris, but fact is there are MUCH bigger things happening which make all of this irrelevant, and it's heart-breaking.

 

I feel your Pain Mr Cox,,,,

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I think most of us are feeling it, and maybe forums like this help take our minds off of the real bad shit happening to our country, but I can't look away. I know there is only so much we can do...the train brakes being applied are much too little too late, and we're going off the cliff whether we want to our not. Like I said, I feel lucky that I ride a bike I dig, have a wonderful wife, good friends, and a job. I also see bad stuff coming...I just hope it's not as bad as I think...I do hope I'm over-analyzing the coming storm.

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I think most of us are feeling it, and maybe forums like this help take our minds off of the real bad shit happening to our country, but I can't look away. I know there is only so much we can do...the train brakes being applied are much too little too late, and we're going off the cliff whether we want to our not. Like I said, I feel lucky that I ride a bike I dig, have a wonderful wife, good friends, and a job. I also see bad stuff coming...I just hope it's not as bad as I think...I do hope I'm over-analyzing the coming storm.

 

The Storm, it's coming

 

keep your powder dry

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  • 2 weeks later...

1 thing to keep in mind with HD & the cutting of jobs. It was very moronic of them in the late 90's early 2000's to put up a Sportster Only plant. As a company, they were only thinking for the now with many decisions. One of the best things they ever did was hold back production in the 90's & have their wait list. It made people want the bikes more & it made their value sky rocket.

 

HD was also about to announce they were cutting production & going back to the list, but earlier in the day, before they could announce it, Polaris announced the buying of Indian, so HD scrapped their plan for the list.

 

Bottom line, HD's short sightedness created many of the jobs they cut.

 

& yes, the clothes & trinket market is much more profitable. If Victory, Indian & Triumph ever get going 7 get dealerships set up where 1/4 is bikes, 1/4 is boutique & 1/4 is parts 7 service, like HD does, I think they will all do much much better. People who buy cruiser type bikes, for the most part want to be in dealerships like HD. They don't want to see snowmobiles & lawn mowers next to their bikes. They don't want a service team of 1 guy & they want parts they can pull of a rack, not a guy ordering it out of a catalog & saying it will take 4 weeks to get. Yeah HD does some of that too, but that is for the actual guys who know a little about their bikes. For the average Joe yuppie, they just want the lasest chrome doo dad they can pull off the wall.

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