Halliburton,the Carlyle Group...

Gary2Wheels · March 11, 2007

Halliburton Will Move HQ to Dubai

Updated 1:13 PM ET March 11, 2007

By JIM KRANE

DUBAI, United Arab Emirates (AP) - Oil services giant Halliburton Co. will soon shift its corporate headquarters from Houston to the Mideast financial powerhouse of Dubai, chief executive Dave Lesar announced Sunday.

"Halliburton is opening its corporate headquarters in Dubai while maintaining a corporate office in Houston," spokeswoman Cathy Mann said in an e-mail to The Associated Press. "The chairman, president and CEO will office from and be based in Dubai to run the company from the UAE."

Lesar, speaking at an energy conference in nearby Bahrain, said he will relocate to Dubai from Texas to oversee Halliburton's intensified focus on business in the Mideast and energy-hungry Asia, home to some of the world's most important oil and gas markets.

"As the CEO, I'm responsible for the global business of Halliburton in both hemispheres and I will continue to spend quite a bit of time in an airplane as I remain attentive to our customers, shareholders and employees around the world," Lesar said. "Yes, I will spend the majority of my time in Dubai."

Lesar's announcement appears to signal one of the highest-profile moves by a U.S. corporate leader to Dubai, an Arab boomtown where free-market capitalism has been paired with some of the world's most liberal tax, investment and residency laws.

"The eastern hemisphere is a market that is more heavily weighted toward oil exploration and production opportunities and growing our business here will bring more balance to Halliburton's overall portfolio," Lesar said.

In 2006, Halliburton _ once headed by Vice President Dick Cheney _ earned profits of $2.3 billion on revenues of $22.6 billion.

More than 38 percent of Halliburton's $13 billion oil field services revenue last year stemmed from sources in the eastern hemisphere, where the firm has 16,000 of its 45,000 employees.

Cheney was Halliburton's chief executive from 1995-2000 and the Bush administration has been accused of favoring the conglomerate with lucrative no-bid contracts in Iraq.

Federal investigators last month alleged Halliburton was responsible for $2.7 billion of the $10 billion in contractor waste and overcharging in Iraq.

Halliburton last month announced a 40-percent decline in fourth-quarter profit, despite heavy demand for its oil field equipment and personnel.

___

On the Net:

Halliburton Co.: http://www.halliburton.com

:huh: So how come it takes a third world country like Brazil to make energy profits from a REWABLE resource?....the scumbags at Halliburton & the Carlye Group are a big part of the worlds energy problem .

Gary2Wheels · March 11, 2007

<_< Mobile VersionHIR2.com

Web This site

Free Download

How will President George W. Bush personally make millions (if not billions) from the War on Terror and Iraq? The old fashioned way. He'll inherit it.

Meet The Carlyle Group

Former World Leaders and Washington Insiders Making Billions in the War on Terrorism

Bush Carlucci Baker Darman Ramos Major

Former

US President and

Vice President

Former Director

of the CIA Former Secretary of Defense and

Deputy Director

of the CIA

More Articles

Five degrees of Osama

Fortune Magazine Frank Carlucci & Donald Rumsfeld

Village Voice

Connections and Then Some

Washington Post

Carlyle's Qinetiq buys into British Spy School

London Observer

Carlyle buys British Government's Technology Arm

Independent News (UK)

Crusader's death won't hurt Carlyle

Washington Post Saudi Royals' Carlyle Money

WP/Seattle Times

Former IRS Commissioner joins Carlyle

Washington Business Journal Carlyle opens office in Seoul, South Korea

Korea Times

United Defense IPO raises $400M

CNN Money Carlyle invests in radio frequency chips

Washington Business Journal

Carlyle buys another government contractor

Washington Business Journal Saudi Gravy Train

Boston Herald

Queen's banker quits to join Carlyle

London Telegraph Army Secretary Thomas "Enron" White plugs the Crusader

Washington Post

aikenscout · March 11, 2007

say it ain't so!

Politicians out to make a buc, or a million or 2?

As it takes multi-millions to even run for office, gee, what's the motivation to run for office? Help your fellow man? Make the world a better place?

:rotfl:

Micmac · March 11, 2007

In my day it was Monsanto. Same thing, only different.

charger · March 11, 2007

LADY BYRD JOHNSON, owned the machinery that paved the HANOI Trail, n I bet she didn't know it....

Brock · March 11, 2007

war was not over oil so just shut that shit up.............and if i had the money to have shares in that company or any other I would do it. nothing wrong with making money......but you are full of shit if you think the reason we went to war was over oil.

if we wanted it that bad we could have sold the IRAQ oil to pay for our losses and finance our presence.....but knew that would go over like a pile of shit at a birthday party. The oil profits are going back into the country.....not into anybodys pockets in USA....

Gary2Wheels · March 11, 2007

war was not over oil so just shut that shit up.............and if i had the money to have shares in that company or any other I would do it. nothing wrong with making money......but you are full of shit if you think the reason we went to war was over oil.

if we wanted it that bad we could have sold the IRAQ oil to pay for our losses and finance our presence.....but knew that would go over like a pile of shit at a birthday party. The oil profits are going back into the country.....not into anybodys pockets in USA....

:huh: Brock,I'll be happy to disagree with you.I'm no boyscout,but clean up your act..all that heat and little light don't make it.Wolfowitz,Cheney,Rumsfeld,claiming the oil profits would pay for the war....the TONS of cash dumped into the pockets of invisable faces..you MUST be kidding.

'We could have sold the IRAQI oil...'?...the pipeline was being blown on a daily basis.We could'nt sell any thing overthere.

Time will tell,but I ask you..if the situation were reversed and IRAQ had bombed and then sent troops in to set up a puppet government..what would you be doing?.....Standin' around?...I don't think so.

The war in Iraq has been the biggest foreign policy mistake this country's ever made.As brutal an SOB as Saddam was,when the UN had him hopping from hole to hole each night,the objective was to contain the situation...and let the UN work.That's what it's for.

Somebody said 'we can blow the world to pieces,but we can't blow the world to peace'.....takes patience and understanding the other guy...always has.

Edited March 11, 2007 by Gary2Wheels

Brock · March 11, 2007

Brock,I'll be happy to disagree with you.I'm no boyscout,but clean up your act..all that heat and little light don't make it.Wolfowitz,Cheney,Rumsfeld,claiming the oil profits would pay for the war....the TONS of cash dumped into the pockets of invisable faces..you MUST be kidding.

'We could have sold the IRAQI oil...'?...the pipeline was being blown on a daily basis.We could'nt sell any thing overthere.

Time will tell,but I ask you..if the situation were reversed and IRAQ had bombed and then sent troops in to set up a puppet government..what would you be doing?.....Standin' around?...I don't think so.

The war in Iraq has been the biggest foreign policy mistake this country's ever made.As brutal an SOB as Saddam was,when the UN had him hopping from hole to hole each night,the objective was to contain the situation...and let the UN work.That's what it's for.

Somebody said 'we can blow the world to pieces,but we can't blow the world to peace'.....takes patience and understanding the other guy...always has.

you are right i came in too strong on that.......yes I disagree with you but i should have tempered it some.

one thing i always think about though is we go in and try to disarm the people instead of disarming the terrorists and shit. If someone came in here and tried to disarm me I dont think I would be going softly either...hell it happened in New Orleans....honest people got disarmed by local police and thugs had their way with them.

I just hear the WE ARE THERE FOR OIL thing and it gets in my craw. Yep we have an interest there for stability due to oil from there being part of our imports. No argument at all with that. Yes we have friends in that area with Israel and Kuwait and UAE.....and to lesser extent Saudis. OPEC is a huge impact on anyones economy.....but to think the only reason we started the war was oil is ludicrous in my opinion.

While they may have said oil profits would be used...that has not been the case as I think they decided AGAINST using the Iraqi oil for just the reasons you highlighted and stuck on......The IRAQI govt is selling the oil and using it to pay contractors and such to get on their feet.... WHat I was saying is if we wanted the oil we could of Americanized the fields and shit and brought it out ourselves to sell and beef up our reserves and drove the OPEC prices through the floor and had .99cent per gallon Regular gas again.....easily.

I think though the processes may have missed the mark and the insurgents were underestimated with the support they would get form outside of IRAQ...I think the goal is the right way to go. Rebuild infrastructure.....help setup economy.....get oil flowing to pay for rebuilding company and stabilizing their currency....and get their government, military and police to point they can take care of themselves....then we slowly exit and wean them from our support.

The operation is a success pretty much everywhere except right in baghdad....as it is a haven for the terrorists. Plus Syria, Saudi and Iran are not helping much... I know a little bit about that part of the world after working there and elsewhere quite a bit in a previous life.....

If it was only the Americans being there that upset the insurgents then they would only be killing Americans...but their bombs are killing hundreds of civilians versus a handful of Americans at a time....they have lost the ability to inflict casualties against us as a country so now they are going against their own people.....actually most of the bombers are not Iraqi but from elsewhere but that is lost in the news as well.

Sorry for the flames buddy........hope this commentary was more appealing... :Duel: :buttrock:

Edited March 11, 2007 by Brock

Canuck · March 12, 2007

Finally a discussion I can get into without being accused of drinking the koolaid or wishing ill-will on Stellican - refreshing.

I have no opinion.

HA! - Me with no opinion?

I believe, based on the flow of money (where the money is going and has gone) and on the subsequent multiple admissions of "faulty intelligence" that oil was the primary driver for the war. Most of Canada believes, if not the same thing, a variation of that - this is why Canada is still in Afghanistan (my brother in law is there right now) but never officially went to Iraq. The unsubstantiated claims that our elite JTF2 was operating there before (and likely after) the start of the war are another matter.

OBL isn't from Iraq, he's from Saudi and was operating out of Pakistan and Afghanistan - but neither of those regions have anything worth taking. The place is at least as unstable as Iraq but the focus is still on the Iraqi war - go figure. Saddam was a bad motherfucker but it was the Taliban that had solidified Afghanistan's position in the stone age. Both parties killed people at will, both parties executed people publicly, both parties ruled by terror. So - the US-led war in Afghanistan was shelved (by and large - but you are still there of course) after a few weeks of carpet-bombing the place further into the stone-age yet once the same level of freedom and peace was bestowed upon the Iraqis, the war/fight/liberation continued. Unlike the continuing fight in Afhganistan however, the Iraqi operation is still a full-fledged "action" with significantly more money and resources being pumped into it than into Afhganistan. A logical question based on those facts is "why?" Why fight an all-out war in Iraq despite having toppled the government, capturing and having hanged the former leader yet in Afghanistan where OBL was never captured, there's only a token force still there?

Could it be that Iraq's oil is a better prize than Afghanistan's poppy fields? Could it be that Iraq is a better geographical location to establish a greater American presence in the region? I don't know.

Pappy · March 12, 2007

Brock,I'll be happy to disagree with you.I'm no boyscout,but clean up your act..all that heat and little light don't make it.Wolfowitz,Cheney,Rumsfeld,claiming the oil profits would pay for the war....the TONS of cash dumped into the pockets of invisable faces..you MUST be kidding.

'We could have sold the IRAQI oil...'?...the pipeline was being blown on a daily basis.We could'nt sell any thing overthere.

Time will tell,but I ask you..if the situation were reversed and IRAQ had bombed and then sent troops in to set up a puppet government..what would you be doing?.....Standin' around?...I don't think so.

The war in Iraq has been the biggest foreign policy mistake this country's ever made.As brutal an SOB as Saddam was,when the UN had him hopping from hole to hole each night,the objective was to contain the situation...and let the UN work.That's what it's for.

Somebody said 'we can blow the world to pieces,but we can't blow the world to peace'.....takes patience and understanding the other guy...always has.

All I know is that since we invaded those pile of crap countries the attacks on US soil has stopped. Previous leadership failed to stop the growing attacks on our embassies and had no reaction to the first attempt to bring down the WTC so the assholes became more and more brave or perhaps unhappy with our lack of response. (If you study their religion, they actually want the end of time war to occur). They finally got our attention and our reaction was to hit back and prevent further attacks. You can bitch and conspiracy theory shit to death but all I know is that our trained soldiers are better equipped to take on attacks than women and children in down town USA.

How quickly fucktards forget.

Can you imagine the outcome of WWII had CNN been ambulance chasing on D-day? Or how about Iwo Jima? As the assholes sip their coffee, could they stomach what we had to do to stop Germany or Japan?

Edited March 12, 2007 by Pappy

aikenscout · March 12, 2007

None of it is any real secret, just have to "follow the money".

See who really has a vested interest in the defense industry. Take a look at the companies that make the bullets, bombs, missles, sonars, radars, aircraft, tanks, electronics, communications, etc, etc, etc. It's cyclical. Billions go to developing that stuff, then ya need to use it, test it in the field, and replenish stocks. Goes back to Dupont making all the gun powder. You would be amazed at the total amount of jobs, businesses, and money that is related to the defense industry, both directly, and inderectly. There will always be a "bad guy" we have to have the big defense contracts for. Ever wonder why we just don't hire somebody for a million bucks and kill someone? Ya think we couldn't have killed Castro and the likes if we really wanted to? Hell, some are considered better to have around to "use" once in awhile. Ain't gonna change, nuthin ya can do about it, and if it really bothers ya, go work for one of em. That side of the government has been paying me for over 26 years. You don't really wan't to know what goes on out there, better just to be happily ignorant most of the time. If it wasn't Iraq, it be someother. Just like that nut case in North Korea. We need assholes like that to keep our nuclear arsenals active. The Russians and the "Cold War" was a classic, and a defense industry's holy grail of excess. Since that one, there will be more smaller ones, same basic effect. You won't go 10 years without a military buildup, ya can count on that one. Right? Wrong? it's above and beyond me, but I'll cash the checks they hand out, just like everyone else. Very few people, and that is in the handfulls, know the real reasons for anything, and it ain't you and me, that's for sure.

Daddyg · March 12, 2007

As a well known general once said:

"My fellow Americans:

Three days from now, after half a century in the service of our country, I shall lay down the responsibilities of office as, in traditional and solemn ceremony, the authority of the Presidency is vested in my successor.

This evening I come to you with a message of leave-taking and farewell, and to share a few final thoughts with you, my countrymen.

Like every other citizen, I wish the new President, and all who will labor with him, Godspeed. I pray that the coming years will be blessed with peace and prosperity for all.

Our people expect their President and the Congress to find essential agreement on issues of great moment, the wise resolution of which will better shape the future of the Nation.

My own relations with the Congress, which began on a remote and tenuous basis when, long ago, a member of the Senate appointed me to West Point, have since ranged to the intimate during the war and immediate post-war period, and, finally, to the mutually interdependent during these past eight years.

In this final relationship, the Congress and the Administration have, on most vital issues, cooperated well, to serve the national good rather than mere partisanship, and so have assured that the business of the Nation should go forward. So, my official relationship with the Congress ends in a feeling, on my part, of gratitude that we have been able to do so much together.

We now stand ten years past the midpoint of a century that has witnessed four major wars among great nations. Three of these involved our own country. Despite these holocausts America is today the strongest, the most influential and most productive nation in the world. Understandably proud of this pre-eminence, we yet realize that America's leadership and prestige depend, not merely upon our unmatched material progress, riches and military strength, but on how we use our power in the interests of world peace and human betterment.

Throughout America's adventure in free government, our basic purposes have been to keep the peace; to foster progress in human achievement, and to enhance liberty, dignity and integrity among people and among nations. To strive for less would be unworthy of a free and religious people. Any failure traceable to arrogance, or our lack of comprehension or readiness to sacrifice would inflict upon us grievous hurt both at home and abroad.

Progress toward these noble goals is persistently threatened by the conflict now engulfing the world. It commands our whole attention, absorbs our very beings. We face a hostile ideology -- global in scope, atheistic in character, ruthless in purpose, and insidious in method. Unhappily the danger is poses promises to be of indefinite duration. To meet it successfully, there is called for, not so much the emotional and transitory sacrifices of crisis, but rather those which enable us to carry forward steadily, surely, and without complaint the burdens of a prolonged and complex struggle -- with liberty the stake. Only thus shall we remain, despite every provocation, on our charted course toward permanent peace and human betterment.

Crises there will continue to be. In meeting them, whether foreign or domestic, great or small, there is a recurring temptation to feel that some spectacular and costly action could become the miraculous solution to all current difficulties. A huge increase in newer elements of our defense; development of unrealistic programs to cure every ill in agriculture; a dramatic expansion in basic and applied research -- these and many other possibilities, each possibly promising in itself, may be suggested as the only way to the road we wish to travel.

But each proposal must be weighed in the light of a broader consideration: the need to maintain balance in and among national programs -- balance between the private and the public economy, balance between cost and hoped for advantage -- balance between the clearly necessary and the comfortably desirable; balance between our essential requirements as a nation and the duties imposed by the nation upon the individual; balance between actions of the moment and the national welfare of the future. Good judgment seeks balance and progress; lack of it eventually finds imbalance and frustration.

The record of many decades stands as proof that our people and their government have, in the main, understood these truths and have responded to them well, in the face of stress and threat. But threats, new in kind or degree, constantly arise. I mention two only.

A vital element in keeping the peace is our military establishment. Our arms must be mighty, ready for instant action, so that no potential aggressor may be tempted to risk his own destruction.

Our military organization today bears little relation to that known by any of my predecessors in peacetime, or indeed by the fighting men of World War II or Korea.

Until the latest of our world conflicts, the United States had no armaments industry. American makers of plowshares could, with time and as required, make swords as well. But now we can no longer risk emergency improvisation of national defense; we have been compelled to create a permanent armaments industry of vast proportions. Added to this, three and a half million men and women are directly engaged in the defense establishment. We annually spend on military security more than the net income of all United States corporations.

This conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence -- economic, political, even spiritual -- is felt in every city, every State house, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources and livelihood are all involved; so is the very structure of our society.

In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the militaryindustrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.

We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together.

Akin to, and largely responsible for the sweeping changes in our industrial-military posture, has been the technological revolution during recent decades.

In this revolution, research has become central; it also becomes more formalized, complex, and costly. A steadily increasing share is conducted for, by, or at the direction of, the Federal government.

Today, the solitary inventor, tinkering in his shop, has been overshadowed by task forces of scientists in laboratories and testing fields. In the same fashion, the free university, historically the fountainhead of free ideas and scientific discovery, has experienced a revolution in the conduct of research. Partly because of the huge costs involved, a government contract becomes virtually a substitute for intellectual curiosity. For every old blackboard there are now hundreds of new electronic computers.

The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present

and is gravely to be regarded.

Yet, in holding scientific research and discovery in respect, as we should, we must also be alert to the equal and opposite danger that public policy could itself become the captive of a scientifictechnological elite.

It is the task of statesmanship to mold, to balance, and to integrate these and other forces, new and old, within the principles of our democratic system -- ever aiming toward the supreme goals of our free society.

Another factor in maintaining balance involves the element of time. As we peer into society's future, we -- you and I, and our government -- must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering, for our own ease and convenience, the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without risking the loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.

Down the long lane of the history yet to be written America knows that this world of ours, ever growing smaller, must avoid becoming a community of dreadful fear and hate, and be instead, a proud confederation of mutual trust and respect.

Such a confederation must be one of equals. The weakest must come to the conference table with the same confidence as do we, protected as we are by our moral, economic, and military strength. That table, though scarred by many past frustrations, cannot be abandoned for the certain agony of the battlefield.

Disarmament, with mutual honor and confidence, is a continuing imperative. Together we must learn how to compose differences, not with arms, but with intellect and decent purpose. Because this need is so sharp and apparent I confess that I lay down my official responsibilities in this field with a definite sense of disappointment. As one who has witnessed the horror and the lingering sadness of war -- as one who knows that another war could utterly destroy this civilization which has been so slowly and painfully built over thousands of years -- I wish I could say tonight that a lasting peace is in sight.

Happily, I can say that war has been avoided. Steady progress toward our ultimate goal has been made. But, so much remains to be done. As a private citizen, I shall never cease to do what little I can to help the world advance along that road.

So -- in this my last good night to you as your President -- I thank you for the many opportunities you have given me for public service in war and peace. I trust that in that service you find some things worthy; as for the rest of it, I know you will find ways to improve performance in the future.

You and I -- my fellow citizens -- need to be strong in our faith that all nations, under God, will reach the goal of peace with justice. May we be ever unswerving in devotion to principle, confident but humble with power, diligent in pursuit of the Nation's great goals.

To all the peoples of the world, I once more give expression to America's prayerful and continuing aspiration:

We pray that peoples of all faiths, all races, all nations, may have their great human needs satisfied; that those now denied opportunity shall come to enjoy it to the full; that all who yearn for freedom may experience its spiritual blessings; that those who have freedom will understand, also, its heavy responsibilities; that all who are insensitive to the needs of others will learn charity; that the scourges of poverty, disease and ignorance will be made to disappear from the earth, and that, in the goodness of time, all peoples will come to live together in a peace guaranteed by the binding force of mutual respect and love."

Dwight D. Eisenhower, 1961

aikenscout · March 12, 2007

And just so ya don't think I don't agree with being over there, I do, not too happy with the execution. I would prefer the Pres. Truman approach. Muslims have declared a holy war against the infidels. We used to talk about the commies and the "domino effect" as they worked on taking over all the little countries. Ya need to take a look at how many are now muslim controlled. Got a good email that makes a good point:

I used to know a man whose family was German aristocracy prior to World War Two. They owned a number of large industries and estates. I asked him how many German people were true Nazis, and the answer he gave has stuck with me and guided my attitude toward fanaticism ever since.

Very few people were true Nazis" he said, "but many enjoyed the return of German pride, and many more were too busy to care. I was one of those who just thought the Nazis were a bunch of fools.

So, the majority just sat back and let it all happen. Then, before we knew it, they owned us, and we had lost control, and the end of the world had come. My family lost everything I ended up in a concentration camp and the Allies destroyed my factories."

We are told again and again by "experts" and "talking heads" that Islam is the religion of peace, and that the vast majority of Muslims just want to live in peace.

Although this unqualified assertion may be true, it is entirely irrelevant. It is meaningless fluff, meant to make us feel better, and meant to somehow diminish the specter of fanatics rampaging across the globe in the name of Islam. The fact is that the fanatics rule Islam at this moment in history.

It is the fanatics who march. It is the fanatics who wage any one of 50 shooting wars worldwide. It is the fanatics who systematically slaughter Christian or tribal groups throughout Africa and are gradually taking over the entire continent in an Islamic wave. It is the fanatics who bomb, behead, murder, or honor kill. It is the fanatics who take over mosque after mosque. It is the fanatics who zealously spread the stoning and hanging of rape victims and homosexuals. The hard quantifiable fact is that the "peaceful majority" is the "silent majority" and it is cowed and extraneous.

Communist Russia comprised Russians who just wanted to live in peace, yet the Russian Communists were responsible for the murder of about 20 million people. The peaceful majority were irrelevant. China's huge population was peaceful as well, but Chinese Communists managed to kill a staggering 70 million people.

The average Japanese individual prior to World War 2 was not a warmongering sadist. Yet, Japan murdered and slaughtered its way across South East Asia in an orgy of killing that included the systematic murder of 12 million Chinese civilians; most killed by sword, shovel, and bayonet. And, who can forget Rwanda , which collapsed into butchery.

Could it not be said that the majority of Rwandans were "peace loving"?

History lessons are often incredibly simple and blunt, yet for all our powers of reason we often miss the most basic and uncomplicated of points:

Peace-loving Muslims have been made irrelevant by their silence.

yupper, can't say it better than that, except just like the Nazi's and the rest of em throughout history, ya need to quit screwin around and kill every damn one of em, quickly and efficiently. These cockroaches aren't going to go away, even when you shine a light on them.

RCH · March 12, 2007

YOU CAN"T HANDLE THE TRUTH!

Gary2Wheels · March 12, 2007

Religion,pride,nationalism.....all this stuff has gotten twisted and convoluted in the name of righteousness.Thanks for all your opinions guys....mine is just one.I mostly agree with each of you,but the cost to our kids and nation coming home with lifelong injuries is staggering.More bombs ain't gonna fix this one..we're gonna have to think our way out.

Pappy · March 12, 2007

Religion,pride,nationalism.....all this stuff has gotten twisted and convoluted in the name of righteousness.Thanks for all your opinions guys....mine is just one.I mostly agree with each of you,but the cost to our kids and nation coming home with lifelong injuries is staggering.More bombs ain't gonna fix this one..we're gonna have to think our way out.

Yep , the same old answer.....nothing. When you and the other tooty fruities "think" up a plan, let us know. We have all been waiting since 9/12.

Oh and in the mean time keep blaming it all on Haliburton (don't you actually mean Cheney), that will fix things in a hurry. You post this crap about Haliburton (again, I know you aren't being political but don't you mean Cheney) and then end with facts about war which we all understand.....people die in war. And your point is?

If you "think" this bunch that wants the end of the world to come quickly because they will go to heaven and not us, gives one flip about or responds to diplomacy, you are pretty darn foolish. Hey just think, we should have scheduled a peace conference with Hitler and talked some sense into the guy. Maybe had him over for some lunch at Applebee's. Heck why didn't someone "think" of that before we started dropping bombs?

Go back to riding your Indian, posting about your last ride and what broke last weekend and get off this political crap. We don't need it.

Canuck · March 12, 2007

Well God-forbid anyone think before they bomb another country into the dark ages.

homer · March 12, 2007

sheesh...we have a lot of problems we should try to fix here first....instead of spending billions and billions on a people that gives a flying fuck about us..

if you have a personal vendetta..fuck it..say so and then blow the fuckers to all hell and get out....if we felt like being nice, we could spend the money rebuilding, instead of maintaining the status quo..there'd probably be 2000 or so American soldiers still breathing today if we did that...but what the hell....it's only 3000 give or take a couple hundred dead (including a relative of mine)--acceptable in any war....we don't care what the rest of the world thinks anyway, do we? (i for one do not)

i don't necessarily have an issue with the mission of the iraq war, but i have a problem with the timing and poor execution....it is more than a opportunity to test out new weapons and flex a little muscle....it's too late to just pull out, but we need to figure it out. after all, we can't leave them hanging again..

and it is about oil..we would be foolish to not want a presence in the middle east, our leaders new we would bull rush the iraqis, we learned that in the first war..they just didn't think about what would happen after the rodeo...what's really amazing is that the price of oil is going down, but the price of gas is steadily rising. we should bomb the oil companies next, screw iraq....

and comparing hitler to saddam is like comparing a chief to a sportser....sure, both were very cruel and pure evil, but they were not even in the same class...not in mass appeal, potential or value.

truth is, american foreign policy has been less than stellar starting at least in the reagan years up 'til now--and now we are paying for it...but our domestic policy leaves a little to be desired too...

but hey, would you want to live anywhere other than north america? i wouldn't..

eric

snogoer · March 12, 2007

Nope-I'm staying out of it......Not going to say a word.....No, no, no....Pop said it all...I think we should dig up that post from our last debate over this muck!

WarEagle · March 12, 2007

Can't you hear the Black Helicopters, they are comming!

Brock · March 12, 2007

one thing forgotten.....there is no draft...nobody is forced to do anything. we have a volunteer force and anyone under the age of 25 is likely one that enlisted or got commissioned AFTER 9-11....

some of us join out of duty to country and do whatever is needed to secure our freedoms.

I went to Bosnia, Kosovo, Uganda, Congo, Rwanda, etc....all under BILL CLINTON. So when you point at Bush for after 9-11.....lets also look at tricky Bill and his fiascos that were not even on the premise of protecting anything...much less freedom.

I retired a couple years ago.....but never blamed my politicians for anything over there other than not giving us enough money to get the equipment and manpower we needed to do it right.....and even in those places under BILL CLINTON.....I did not want to leave before we SUCCEEDED.

homer · March 12, 2007

kinda funny, but i don't think there's that much disagreement here...maybe rightest blame and lefty and lefist blame a righty just to justify their position, but we all see where the politicians bend to public opinion on some things and don't bend on others....i don't envy them, they got a tough row to hoe, esp when dealing with human lives.

I'm a middle-est..mildly conservative on some issues, extremely liberal on others (like naked women)....I don't think the name of the politician matters... they all have their own agendas. If you enlist, you do so knowing the price you may pay... doesn't make it any better that you may die for something you may or may not believe in...it's your job..

I for one am thankful for and to those that enlist to do that job--regardless if i believe in the mission or not. there's a slight difference in military and civi life--when i get tired, or bored, or come to hate my job, i can leave...and there's no one shooting at me...and i know i owe that to those who don't have that option.

like i said before, and i think brock just agreed, the politicians biggest mistake is not letting our boys and girls get the job done properly...whether that means cleaning house or holding hands, they always seem to bound them with the "rules of engagement"...

eric

Pappy · March 12, 2007

kinda funny, but i don't think there's that much disagreement here...maybe rightest blame and lefty and lefist blame a righty just to justify their position, but we all see where the politicians bend to public opinion on some things and don't bend on others....i don't envy them, they got a tough row to hoe, esp when dealing with human lives.

I'm a middle-est..mildly conservative on some issues, extremely liberal on others (like naked women)....I don't think the name of the politician matters... they all have their own agendas. If you enlist, you do so knowing the price you may pay... doesn't make it any better that you may die for something you may or may not believe in...it's your job..

I for one am thankful for and to those that enlist to do that job--regardless if i believe in the mission or not. there's a slight difference in military and civi life--when i get tired, or bored, or come to hate my job, i can leave...and there's no one shooting at me...and i know i owe that to those who don't have that option.

like i said before, and i think brock just agreed, the politicians biggest mistake is not letting our boys and girls get the job done properly...whether that means cleaning house or holding hands, they always seem to bound them with the "rules of engagement"...

eric

Well said.

snogoer · March 12, 2007

This is how Pop put it and I think he is right on about the whole mess!

OK Snogoer, just for you my friend. But don't be surprised if you get a bill from CVS for the increased milligrams of my meds.

First off, WMDs. Like it makes a whit's worth of difference. That country wuz locked up tighter than a nuns... uhh... rosaries. The flyboys doing they bit in Germany and Turkey and the carrier dogs wuz getting the benefit of live fire practice on that silly excuse for a army. Has any of ya seen how much bullshit our military has to go through to get permission to do live fire air to ground and air to air? Iraq wuz daddy Bush's gift that kept on giving.

Tinhorn, you betcha. Tyrant, you betcha. Mass murderer, sho nuff. Since when is any a that our cross to bear? They want a friggin democratic form of gummint, Pop sez let 'em get up and fight and die for it. This country isn't Gummints R Us. Not the USA's job to pave the way for any oppressed SOB to stand up and be counted if he doesn't stand up on his own. Stand them up shit. The deal used to be, you want US intervention, bring something to the table on the front end. Show us the money or show us some bleeding for the cause or show us where the USA is safer for it and we'll cover your butt. Lot's a talk about oil but until it shows up in my pumps, I just as soon give my petro bux to the Exxon scalpers and that friggin commie in Venezuela. Lot's a talk about WMD and all but there's plenty other tinhorns that have more cash and ain't getting pasted by warthogs daily and have they eyes on that prize. So where are we? Stuck in a goddamn civil war between three groups of muslims. For fucksake.

Nobody prevented GW and the Rumster from playin it as they seen fit right from the git go. Free reign, open checkbook, they had the table and the dice. All they had to do was roll. Now it's gone down the crapper and the democrats are in and you just know they going to put the fucks to the free ride. Well, so be it. Somebody or the other said that it's not the job of government to keep its citizen from getting into trouble but that it is that job of citizens to keep their government from getting into trouble… or something like that. Anyway the last election pretty well held up the citizens end of the bargain.

The boneheads had a shot and they tripped over they own dicks right out in front of god and everybody. Fuck 'em. Fuck Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld and Perle and Wolfowitz and Hillery and Lieberman and Condi and the rest of the numbskulls that made a simple act of retribution, read that bomb Bin Laden and the Taliban until the bombs fall out the other side a the earth from the hole where Afghanistan used to be, fuck 'em all for turning they back on that righteous act and giving it over to the UN so in the meantime they could try and germinate western values in the middle of camel country.

If any a this is our duty to do, it seems to me that we would be on the ground in the Sudan pickin off the towelheads that are committing genocide (Colin Powell called it that and I believe he got that right even if he wuz a puppet on a string over Iraq.)? Iran, Syria, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba, to name a few other countries that may now or in the future possess WMD and with them we either talk or ignore but Saddam livin on the edge while we lambaste him from the no fly zone, him we have this urgent need to protect ourselves from.

So, wuz Saddam scheming for WMD or wuzn't? Sure why not? If I were a megalomaniac penned up in the corner I would say boo to anybody that would jump. He had us jumpin through hoops. After daddy Bush sent him home in a shambles he wuz a thorn in the side a Clinton. Not only a thorn, he wuz a convenient shill. The worst thing, well the second worst thing after the countless dead and the civil war that is just busting loose, is that he wuz a fine enemy. I'm sayin he laid there and let us drop ordinance in for over a decade while our leaders callin him the boogeyman under the bed. Perfect. A nation needs a bad guy to keep the homefires burning. The trick of that method is you got to keep dangling him in front of the lion's maw but you don't ever let the lion get to him. Then, whenever a real threat pops up you just do the bait and switch and BINGO let the lions loose on the real threat all hungry and chafin at the bit.

It wuz glorious too. Runnin through the Taliban like shit through a goose. No better choice of assholes to butcher that I can think of off the top of my head. So right inna middle of that, what does they do? Bait and switch reverse. Substitute that knothead Saddam in where Osammy had been the real boogeyman. WTF over. Sometimes the level of sheep us Americans got bred into us makes me think all of us has Turkish goatherd in our DNA. We just turned on a dime for that line. Man, if the Whitehouse wuz car dealers, we woulda all been drivin Yugos.

Here's that Al Qaida asshole livin large back in the scrub and we're all up in Saddam got caught. Sorry shit. Sorry sorry shit. As long as friggin Bin Laden breathes the same air that I do my lungs are soiled. Instead, he's gone from the press reports, nobody inna Whitehouse wants to talk about him, we're all pals with Musharaf over in Pakistan and yet the intel claims Osammy is fiddling around the Afghan Pakistan border. Inna meantime we're getting potshots took at us in a country where the most of those assholes want us to leave.

Gee, call it cut and run. I call it fuck you Ackmed. We put 150000 of you shitheels up in uniform with three squares, and trained yer ass. Now get it out there and save your own damn ass. I am done with you. And oh yeah, as soon as you get it sorted out, let us know. We'll be back for our oil.

Gary2Wheels · March 12, 2007

YEP.....I only hope it works out that way.If they want a country like ours,they're gonna have to do it themselves.All the Muslims,Kurds,and whatever mix there is over there is gonna have to do some thing never before done...totally self destruct or unite as a country ready to contribute to the world.I'm not holding my breath....

Sign In

Halliburton,the Carlyle Group...

Recommended Posts

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Link to comment

Share on other sites

Join the conversation