Interesting indian comments...

[junior]

Just wondering if anyone was still around. I read the recent Quarterly report, anyone have anything they want to add?

Cheers,

TheBandGuy

 

 

 

I'm still around, but I don't own an Indian. I own a Drifter and dream of an Indian. Wanted one since I was a little kid, but time goes by and money never builds up.

Drifter Dave (Bluzglide) 2001 800 Drifter VROC 15117

 

 

 

1646.3 in reply to 1646.2  

 

I'm in the same boat here. Can't wait for them to ramp up to production again!!

Cheers,

TheBandGuy

 

 

 

1646.4 in reply to 1646.3  

Depends on whether they are just S&S Harley clones or real Indians. Gilroy bought the name but didn't do justice to the marque. They turned out bikes that were nothing like the old Indians. They were too big, heavy and didn't handle well. The Indian was a fairly light bike with great handling. That's why I like my Drifter. It's an 800 with weight and size and handling ability (not to mention looks) similar to an old early 40s Scout Sport. If the new company can turn out bikes as good as Kawasaki does with their Drifter, at a reasonable price (Gilroy's were way too expensive), then I will look again at them. The Gilroy built Indian was priced high enought that one couls get a resored old Indian for about the same price. So, why buy new?

So, that being said, I would imagine that some people (if tere were any here) would argue with my opinions, but they are just that...my opinions. We all have them and we are all entitled to state them.

I am an Indian lover from way (about 45years) back, and will always love the old Springfield Indians. They are the only true Indians. The only thing coming close right now is the Drifter.

Drifter Dave (Bluzglide) 2001 800 Drifter VROC 15117  

From:  K.R.A.B. (TheBandGuy)   Sep-8 4:14 pm  

 

 

To:  Drifter (bluzglide)   (5 of 10)  

1646.5 in reply to 1646.4  

 

Certainly valid opinions. I have a fondness for the older Indians as well, my Grandfather used to ride one back and forth to work year round during the days of gas rationing. In the winter, he'd be find in the morning, but by the time he was coming home, he would have ride with both feet down to keep from slipping on the ice!

 

I have seen Aeros like mine converted into Indian tribute bikes, and I think that Kawasaki did a great job in honoring some of Indian's original design ideas as well. And while it would be nice to own an original Sprinfield Indian, I'd much rather have the reliability of a newer bike, because I prefer to ride than wrench, though I've gotten pretty good at both.

Cheers,

TheBandGuy  

 

 

1646.6 in reply to 1646.5  

I wrenched my own rides for the last 35 years, but now I'm just either too tired or too lazy to do it. I have the "new" bike I want. The next one I get will be an old Springfield Indian. Haven't decided on a Chief or Scout Sport, but it depends on what I find I guess.

Just hope to find one is all!

Drifter Dave (Bluzglide) 2001 800 Drifter VROC 15117  

 

1646.7 in reply to 1646.4  

 

I think your out of line and a disrespectful of the owners of Gilroy Indians with your opinions that you "are entitled to state".

If you want to express yourself in that manor I suggest you go to "Cycle Bash"

Thse people are very proud of their Indian Motorcycles and some have scratched and saved , made sacrifices to finally get their dream fulfilled.

I don't own an Indian.I also like the Springfield Indians but it would be silly to think that one could be a daily rider in todays world of heavy traffic and the high speeds required to go on the freeways today.

I'd be very proud to own a Gilroy Indian as my daily rider.

How would the members of the drifter riders forum like it if I was to state that the Drifter is a cheep Japanies "want to be" Indian with plastic fenders, a radiator and poor fit & finish?

I'll bet the Drifter members wouldn't sit back and let me away with that crap.At least I hope not.

The people on this "Indian Motorcycles" forum are totally respectful of other brands and welcome all.

This is JUST MY OPINION AND I'M ENTITLED TO STATE IT (LOL)

John

 

 

 

Yes, it is your opinion and you are entitled to state it. However, I didn't intend to "bash" Gilroy Indians. What I said was that the Gilroy Indians were heavy, didn't handle well and were expensive. At what point is that "bashing" or "disrespectful"?

If you were to go and bash Drifters because they were "cheap japanese imitations of Indians with plastic fenders" then you would be wrong. The Drifter isn't an imitation Indian. It's a tribute to the Springfield Indian with it's performance and handling and looks. If you chose to bash it because it wasn't a Drifter or a Kawasaki, then you would be within your rights. I never "bashed" the Gilroy for being a bad Drifter, only for being an Indian in name only. If that is against your beliefs, so be it. Also, I never bashed the Gilroy as a bike. Those that saved and bought Gilroy Indians bought what they wanted and for that I have nothing but praise. They found what they liked and went for it. It just isn't for me. I have never bashed anyone for their choice of bike. We all have the right to ride what we like, BUT...if opinions not shared by the "whole" are not welcome here, then I will find another place to talk about Indians. Many on the Drifter forum also own Springfield Indians and have no problem with that. They love the Drifters. Some also hate the Gilroys. That is their right. I have the right to not like them either. I don't have the right to put someone down for owning one (which I never did). I hope you understand what I'm saying here. I love Indians, but the old ones. Anything..and I repeat anything (including Drifters, Gilroys, and whatever else comes along) are not, IMO, Indians. They might have the name and the look, but not the heritage or the class.

As I said, I hope you understand my reasoning here. If you still don't like it, then the moderator is welcome to remove my post and kick me off the forum.

It will be a sad day, though, if an Indian lover is not allowed on an Indian forum.

 

Drifter Dave (Bluzglide)

2001 800 Drifter

VROC 15117

 

 

 

1646.9 in reply to 1646.8  

 

If you make your comments on your forum , that's one thing , but to bring your crap here is Bashing.

Some just have to convince themselves about their rides , it happens with many brands like Drifter vs Gilroy and HD vs Road Star and so on ,...mostly "newbies"

Now to be clear I stated "what if" (my last post) and "mostly newbies" this post.You come across as an "I said you said" kind of guy.

You stated that the Gilroys are too expensive, ... well I say "you only get what you paid for".

That's all I have to say on this forum and suggest that your topic would fit in well at Cycle bash.

 

 

 

 

1646.10 in reply to 1646.9  

 

I still say that what I said wasn't "bashing" but only observation. If you can find ANYTHING false or wrong in that message, quote it here and I will apologise. I said ONLY they were big (true) heavy (again true) didn't handle well (opinion based on riding one) and expensive (based on pricing them). If ANY of this is "bashing" then you obviously don't know the meaning of the word and are way too sensitive about your machine.

I stated FACTS (with the possible exception of the handling, which i said was my opinion from test rides). You have come here to BASH ME! It reeks of "I'm better than you!" attitude. Well...guess what? You aren't! I ride what I ride until I find a Springfield Indian, and even then will keep my Drifter. You ride what you want and I don't fault you for it. If I think you paid an excessive price, that is my rigt to say. You feel you got what you paid for and that is cool too. Why can'y you just re-read what I wrote and see it for what it is (fact and one opinion), rather than for what YOU PERCIEVE it to be (bashing).

If you are indicative of the others on this forum, then I am not interested in staying here. I was of the opinion it was a forum for Indian owners or lovers. You give the impression that it is nothing more than a forum for praising Gilroy.

Drifter Dave (Bluzglide) 2001 800 Drifter VROC 15117

 

 

Gilroy Indian Bashers...You got one on Every Forum....

 

 

 

 

Junior!!

[Nasty]

The guy is a homo...

[Maldev]

Where's that forum?  Seems like a lot of fun to me and I want to join!

[Brock]

obviously the guy has never really checked out a Gilroy Indian much less rode one.....

 

-poor fit and finish?  they might have other problems but the bikes were nothing short of stunning...still are.

 

-too heavy?  No heavier than the piece of shit he is riding now...top heavy....I dont think he knows of what he speaks...especially with the 99-01 models.

 

-poor handling?  wow....he definately has not rode a 2002+ framed bike...or a earlier model with upgraded fork guts and new shocks and gotten rid of the maxxis rubbers...

 

mmmmmm..where is this forum?

[porkchop]

They are Obviously Gay

[KC Cheef]

Well fuck!!

Now I have to show my kinder gentler side.

I kind of feel sorry for them.

They want the real deal--and can't or won't afford to have one.

Only thing I'd agree with him on is--to me anyway--BIG DIFFERENCE from what we ride and what Springfield put out.

I'm still trying to make up my mind if we're RIDING Indians or honoring the old ones.

[2blackbelts]

The debate between Gilroy and Sprinfield Indian always gets people in an uproar, and which is the true Indian.

 

However, there is another little chapter in history regarding motorcycles that the HD riders do not want to address, and that was the AMF takeover.

 

Why is a Gilroy Indian not a true Indian, and yet, an AMF bowling machine HD is still a true Harley?

 

Harley completely and totally sold out in I believe 1970 to another company, which was AMF, who owned them for 11 years.  Gilroy Indians were totally brought back in the late 90's.  So why is HD more legitimate than Indian?

 

Bottom line, the Gilroy Indians, in my mine, are still the real deal.

 

2blackbelts

[paolabob]

WTF! The guy states that the Gilroys don't look anything like the Springfields, show me anything that was produced 50 years ago and what it looks like now....no comparison! I think Gilroy did a good job in designing the "new bikes". Stuff that asshole and his Drifter in a cooler. Now where is that web site Junior so we might go express ourselves and our opinions?

[TEX]

I'll turn and burn in the twisties with rocknroll rythm. 02 chief frame is rigid.kw monoshock suspension just like the best handling bikes made today. Disagree with his assesment about handling. Not True, even the clearance is no problem. Never scraped a floorboard. Guy is not knowledgable just opionated. TEX.

[Micmac]

I think a Drifter Rider talking about Chief ridin, would be like me talking about Drifter riding, I ain't never done it (never will). I won't put the man down for his ride. They obviously don't know what the fuck their talking about either of them. I've had older Chiefs, back in the day, had a 741 Army Scout too. I loved them. Once I get two kids through college, or sell the shovel, I plan on getting another Springfield Chief. But I will tell you one thing for sure, there is no comparison in comfort, and performance between my "02" and the older ones. Fuck, I was strolling down Interstate 95 to Charlotte and back today 85 mph + for several hours. You could not do that with a Springfield, you'd shake to death. I'm sure some will take issue with me, and maybe someone has an old Springfield they be willing to put through that, but who'd want to?

[homer]

he obviously hasn't ridden wiggy and marge after joe lowered them and esp. after he put in the race tec front end....

let's not even mention the malfa rebuild on wiggy and the blackhawk rebuild on marge..performance isn't in question either...oh yeah..and i think gilroy actually did a great job of making an indian as it would be today if the company had produced bikes the whole time..

the drifter seems small and maybe too retro imho...

eric

[twinmountains]

Don't you just hate it when people "don't know what they're writing about".  I traded my HD after 800 miles because it was totally top heave and hard to manuver and yes expensive for the little bit of chrome that came on it (dyna lowrider).  I love my SPIRIT,  it's balanced so you don't notice the weight and yes at 5FT nothing I can pick it up (have a few times) because of the great engineering.  I can manuver it better than anyone, even made it through the MSF box (safety course).  Sounds like the drifter guy just needs to learn how to ride. :Spanish:

[POWER STROKE]

What makes the post so funny is that his opinion is based on nothing but speculation. He obviously never read any of the rags reviews of the '02 Chief. I mean even the jap rag editors had nothing but praise for it!

I like this," I'm entitled to state my opinion"

Heres 2 of my favorites:

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one, and they all stink.

If I want your opinion, I'll give it to you.

[Pop]

C'mon Jr, fess up. Where's this joker lurking anyways?

 

An anudder ting.

 

I'm a Ford man. So, '65 Mustang, '75 Mustang, '85 Mustang, '95 Mustang, '05 Mustang.

 

I could step right out of a time machine from '65 and pick an '05 out of a lineup. Not so easy with the intermediate decades, but what they were is what they are and how they got from there to here is what it is.

 

AMF made Harleys. Still got my good old '78. I pretty much got the read I need when some cat calls it a bowling ball. It's a HD. Yep, right there on the title.

 

Gilroy made Indians. Still have my good old '03. I pretty much got the read I need when some cat calls it a pretendian. It's an Indian. Yep, right there on the title.

 

When some Hendee purist starts up that mumbo jumbo, I just gotta smile. They honed that rant when the factory was rebadging Royal Enfields. Thing is them that did the rebadging owned the rights, so when they rebadged them, those Enfields became Indians. Plain and simple. The whiny bitches can be the queen of denial til the cows come home but it is what it is.

I  been putting together a coupla vintage HD's and I  dealt with enough of those peckerwoods to not believe a damn thing any of them says anyways, at least until I can check it out. AMCA has such tight standards because (with apologies to my AMCA brethren) the membership would sell they mama to beat a brother to the best original unrestored trophy, so when they get all up in themselves over the lineage and what is real and what ain't, consider the source.

 

If you build your life around an extinct marquee and then it is resurrected, boy don't that throw a wrench in the works. Hell, we ain't no better. If Stellican makes a plastic fendered water cooled pink polkadot motorcycle from offshore parts and markets it as an Indian, there's gonna be a bunch of squawkin goin on round heah.

 

We can squawk to kingdom come but it'll be smoke because whatever Stellican builds, (I know, KC I know... IF they build)whatever they build, if they put the badge on it and say it's Indian, it is.

 

This ain't rocket scientry. I seen Dodge Chargers that I could fit in a corn flakes box, Rivieras that could get blown off the road from a dust devil. Don't look like Rivs to me, but sure enough, there it is right on the trunk lid, Riviera. Yep, no doubt about it.

 

Twas ever thus.

[axxman]

Where's BadCad when you need him?  

[Scottdog]

I honor Henry Ford and his Model "T" by driving a Ford Festiva.

 

       

[Rosie]

Where's BadCad when you need him?  

Last I heard, He was at Neverland Ranch......

[POWER STROKE]

Well said Pop!

[MeanGene]

Chevys are like assholes, everyone has one, and they all stink.

Well said, blue  

[badcad]

Where's BadCad when you need him?  

Last I heard, He was at Neverland Ranch......

Lay off Michael. He just wants to be white and sleep with little boys. Half of your church pastors, priests and reverends are doing that very same thing..... rarosenow for president of NAMBLA!

[Guest_ikonboard]

I am sure some will disagree with what I said and I am sure some of it make no sense atall but this is what I posted in response to Drifter Dave

 

Drifter Dave,

 

Yep, you have every right to your opinion… no matter how ignorant it is.

 

“too big, heavy and didn't handle well” By that line alone it proves you never rode one. I know, I know… in your post you claim to have but one of two things happened; you lied about riding one or you had a negative opinion prior to your ride and nothing would change it.

 

Too big, I dunno? How little are you? For people much over 5’ 8” the Drifter gets to be a bit cramped. At 6’ 5” it’s way too tight a fit for me.

 

I will say that the 99 – 01 Chiefs had a few handling issues but these are cruisers not GP bikes and they fit that bill fine. The main issue was the forks, a quick rebuild with a few minor modifications and that is taken care of. Just take a ride with RCH across the Ortega Highway and you will see how well the bike can take the twisty mountain roads when a person who knows how to ride is on the bike. Now if you had a hard time pushing it around in a parking lot, oh well, I like to be on the road at speeds over 20 MPH and could careless how much work a bike is to park; unless you only bar hop you shouldn’t be spending much time doing that anyway.

 

Now if you want to move up to the 02 – 04 Chief with their KW Monoshock suspension, Paoli forks, Brembo Brakes and square tube frame; there is a cruiser that can fool you into thinking you are on a sport bike. Add to that the 100ci engine which, after a few modifications (Thanks to the mind of Mr. Malfa) averages over 50 MPG; think about it; twice the ci of a Drifter and better mileage.

 

Dead weight is not the only thing you should consider, it’s the distribution of that weight that matters. My wife can pick up my 2000 Chief but not her 1994 Sportster which is a couple hundred pounds lighter; 489 verse 650 for the S&S Chief, 690 for the Power Plus. The Sporty is way to top heavy. Oh, and the 800 Drifter is about 540 pounds, only 100 pounds less then the 99 – 01 Chiefs and 50 pounds heavier then a Sporty.

 

The 88ci (1450) or the 100ci (1638) should be able to handle the few extra pounds quite well compared to the 50ci (800) Drifter.

 

The 99 – 01 Chiefs have a 24 seat height compared to the 28 seat height on the 02 - 04 Chief and the 30 inch seat height of the Drifter.

 

I own both models from Gilroy (as well as several other bikes including rice) and my neighbor has an 800 Drifter. I know the bikes pretty well.

 

I have been riding bikes for over 30 years. All bikes have their purpose and the bikes Indian built out of Gilroy did their job well as cruisers. Both versions of the Chief do very well at highway speeds. We ride these bikes at 75 MPH plus on the highways of California without problem. Let’s see a Springfield bike keep up… by the way, there are many around here and their owners would tell you they won’t. Even the guys I know with Drifters will not do some of our long day rides with us.

 

Expensive? Again you have opened a door which shows your lack of knowledge on this subject. The Indians are only expensive if you would also compare the price of a spaghetti dinner to that of a steak dinner. Sure the steak dinner will be more but it is a different meal and experience. Both a steak dinner and a spaghetti dinner can be satisfying, and some (like me) even prefer a spaghetti dinner over steak. But in no way does that make a comparison of the two dinners logical.

 

To compare Indian to Kawasaki is not valid. To compare Indian to Harley, Victory or other American built V-Twins is a bit more logical. The Chief come out much cheaper then a COMPARABLE Harley. Meaning once you bring a Harley up to the level of dress and performance that an Indian has while on the showroom floor you will be spending much more on that Harley. Studies have shown it to be at least an extra $3,000 (depending on model) just in appearance items, once you try to push the performance up with the screaming eagle parts, them dollars just keep on adding up.

 

Personally I think the Drifter is a great tribute to the Springfield era Indians and I stand up for them all the time. And I get #### for it many times, too bad for the people who have to be unhappy about what others ride. But just like the modern Harley’s and Yamaha’s have little resemblance to the bikes of their brand own from bygone days; neither should the modern era Indians. Times have changed, roads have changed and technology has changed. Indian has decided to produce a bike that has 1940’s style on a modern size and engineered bike. Kawasaki decided to bolt some plastic fenders on a Vulcan (Oh, and while were at it… stupid move to bolt to the swing arm, That whole inch worm look is sooooo 1980’s break dance style) after seeing another company (whose name slips my mind at the moment. Now I remember, COBRA) did one up as a concept bike. Yep, the Drifter is much closer to the Springfield’s in size but it still is not an Indian.

 

Oh, and you can think that my bikes aren’t Indians all you want, the title says they are. And if that is not good enough for you I would have to assume that any Indian built after the 1910’s is not a real Indian being that the founders were both gone. One thing for sure is your Drifter will always be a Kawasaki.

 

Yep, you can have your opinion, but its as valid as the opinion of the flat earth society, people who believe that we never made it to the moon and Michael Moore.

[indian al]

The debate between Gilroy and Sprinfield Indian always gets people in an uproar, and which is the true Indian.

 

However, there is another little chapter in history regarding motorcycles that the HD riders do not want to address, and that was the AMF takeover.

 

Why is a Gilroy Indian not a true Indian, and yet, an AMF bowling machine HD is still a true Harley?

 

Harley completely and totally sold out in I believe 1970 to another company, which was AMF, who owned them for 11 years.  Gilroy Indians were totally brought back in the late 90's.  So why is HD more legitimate than Indian?

 

Bottom line, the Gilroy Indians, in my mine, are still the real deal.

 

2blackbelts

Hey 2 black belts thats a very good point I never hear of any HD riders saying the AMF bikes werent HD's. When I rode harleys I never grouped them that way either. Makes you wonder why they feel its necessary to group indians like that. Oh well fuck em.

 

Later Al

[Chiefin]

[indian al]

I am sure some will disagree with what I said and I am sure some of it make no sense atall but this is what I posted in response to Drifter Dave

 

Drifter Dave,

 

Yep, you have every right to your opinion… no matter how ignorant it is.

 

“too big, heavy and didn't handle well” By that line alone it proves you never rode one. I know, I know… in your post you claim to have but one of two things happened; you lied about riding one or you had a negative opinion prior to your ride and nothing would change it.

 

Too big, I dunno? How little are you? For people much over 5’ 8” the Drifter gets to be a bit cramped. At 6’ 5” it’s way too tight a fit for me.

 

I will say that the 99 – 01 Chiefs had a few handling issues but these are cruisers not GP bikes and they fit that bill fine. The main issue was the forks, a quick rebuild with a few minor modifications and that is taken care of. Just take a ride with RCH across the Ortega Highway and you will see how well the bike can take the twisty mountain roads when a person who knows how to ride is on the bike. Now if you had a hard time pushing it around in a parking lot, oh well, I like to be on the road at speeds over 20 MPH and could careless how much work a bike is to park; unless you only bar hop you shouldn’t be spending much time doing that anyway.

 

Now if you want to move up to the 02 – 04 Chief with their KW Monoshock suspension, Paoli forks, Brembo Brakes and square tube frame; there is a cruiser that can fool you into thinking you are on a sport bike. Add to that the 100ci engine which, after a few modifications (Thanks to the mind of Mr. Malfa) averages over 50 MPG; think about it; twice the ci of a Drifter and better mileage.

 

Dead weight is not the only thing you should consider, it’s the distribution of that weight that matters. My wife can pick up my 2000 Chief but not her 1994 Sportster which is a couple hundred pounds lighter; 489 verse 650 for the S&S Chief, 690 for the Power Plus. The Sporty is way to top heavy. Oh, and the 800 Drifter is about 540 pounds, only 100 pounds less then the 99 – 01 Chiefs and 50 pounds heavier then a Sporty.

 

The 88ci (1450) or the 100ci (1638) should be able to handle the few extra pounds quite well compared to the 50ci (800) Drifter.

 

The 99 – 01 Chiefs have a 24 seat height compared to the 28 seat height on the 02 - 04 Chief and the 30 inch seat height of the Drifter.

 

I own both models from Gilroy (as well as several other bikes including rice) and my neighbor has an 800 Drifter. I know the bikes pretty well.

 

I have been riding bikes for over 30 years. All bikes have their purpose and the bikes Indian built out of Gilroy did their job well as cruisers. Both versions of the Chief do very well at highway speeds. We ride these bikes at 75 MPH plus on the highways of California without problem. Let’s see a Springfield bike keep up… by the way, there are many around here and their owners would tell you they won’t. Even the guys I know with Drifters will not do some of our long day rides with us.

 

Expensive? Again you have opened a door which shows your lack of knowledge on this subject. The Indians are only expensive if you would also compare the price of a spaghetti dinner to that of a steak dinner. Sure the steak dinner will be more but it is a different meal and experience. Both a steak dinner and a spaghetti dinner can be satisfying, and some (like me) even prefer a spaghetti dinner over steak. But in no way does that make a comparison of the two dinners logical.

 

To compare Indian to Kawasaki is not valid. To compare Indian to Harley, Victory or other American built V-Twins is a bit more logical. The Chief come out much cheaper then a COMPARABLE Harley. Meaning once you bring a Harley up to the level of dress and performance that an Indian has while on the showroom floor you will be spending much more on that Harley. Studies have shown it to be at least an extra $3,000 (depending on model) just in appearance items, once you try to push the performance up with the screaming eagle parts, them dollars just keep on adding up.

 

Personally I think the Drifter is a great tribute to the Springfield era Indians and I stand up for them all the time. And I get #### for it many times, too bad for the people who have to be unhappy about what others ride. But just like the modern Harley’s and Yamaha’s have little resemblance to the bikes of their brand own from bygone days; neither should the modern era Indians. Times have changed, roads have changed and technology has changed. Indian has decided to produce a bike that has 1940’s style on a modern size and engineered bike. Kawasaki decided to bolt some plastic fenders on a Vulcan (Oh, and while were at it… stupid move to bolt to the swing arm, That whole inch worm look is sooooo 1980’s break dance style) after seeing another company (whose name slips my mind at the moment. Now I remember, COBRA) did one up as a concept bike. Yep, the Drifter is much closer to the Springfield’s in size but it still is not an Indian.

 

Oh, and you can think that my bikes aren’t Indians all you want, the title says they are. And if that is not good enough for you I would have to assume that any Indian built after the 1910’s is not a real Indian being that the founders were both gone. One thing for sure is your Drifter will always be a Kawasaki.

 

Yep, you can have your opinion, but its as valid as the opinion of the flat earth society, people who believe that we never made it to the moon and Michael Moore.

Nice one LR you will let us know if he replies wont you.

 

Later Al

[porkchop]

I sent him a note too...

 

It says...

 

 

You are Obviously Gay